When Sex Is A Weapon: Surviving Date Rape

CaleeKay
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 05:52 pm: [report]

wow. regardless of how many stories i have heard about rape, that story gave me goosebumps, and just left me speechless.

majicksand
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 06:09 pm: [report]

This is why I believe in the death penalty for sexual predators.  Not after a dozen years and countless appeals.  Immediately upon leaving the courtroom in cases where there is irrefutable DNA.  Their victims have to live with what they did.  They should not be given that opportunity.

Please don’t tell me how terrible I am or try to change my mind on this.  Sexual predators do not deserve kindness or mercy.  They are evil and should die.  Preferably slowly and painfully, but I’ll compromise as far as lethal injection.

MissChaotic
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 06:16 pm: [report]

Majicksand, I agree wholeheartedly. At least he suffered and died a painful death. However, that’s biological terrorism, spreading AIDS like that, and I hope Satan kept a warm spot in hell open for him.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 07:17 pm: [report]

Killing (euthanizing) violent criminals is on my list when I become Regent of the World.

Goldfinch86
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 07:27 pm: [report]

While I do not condone the death of rapists, I do believe life in jail for them is a fate much worse than death, as is the same with those who molest children. My father is a Corrections Officer, trust me he knows what they do to each other and what officers let happen to these men. They are raped, they have their teeth knocked out so they cannot bite when they are sodomized, they are beaten not only by other inmates by sometimes guards allow the beating to happen, pairing a rapist with a violent prisoner who will “do the right thing”.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 07:43 pm: [report]

@Goldfinch86: From a purely economic standpoint you can’t stand for more deaths in the prison system because that means less people for your dad to watch meaning he has less to do and perhaps the loss of a job.

I still want the eye for and eye back. Waht ever happened to Hammurabi?

MarieMacCee
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 07:46 pm: [report]

I don’t think I could ever be judge and jury for a criminal, and as someone who has been taken advantage of by a man I am intimately familiar with the desire for revenge. But the idea that prison guards take it upon themselves to facilitate dangerous situations for inmates to see justice done doesn’t sit well with me. If I worked day in and day out with horrible men who had done horrible things I think I also would consider myself capable of deciding what to do, but that’s not in keeping with our justice system. Our judicial system is bureaucratic, and inefficient, and expensive, and insensitive, but its also all we have to enforce some sort of moral code.
  I don’t know how to properly punish sex offenders, because so many of them are mentally unstable, but whatever we do should be legal. And more importantly, we need to take better care of the victims, many of whom are afraid to come forward and suffer from trauma for the rest of their lives. Women and children need to feel safer (as do any male victims).

Knitter79
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 08:02 pm: [report]

I’m with goldfinch86.  Death would be a quick end and not nearly bad enough to get justice for their victims.  Send them to prison and let them experience what it feels like to be held down and brutally violated.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 08:16 pm: [report]

@Knitter79: To you I respond, we should either go back to public executions or public stonings. Either way, fun for the whole family.

PotteryGirl
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 08:23 pm: [report]

@majicksand - you said exactly what I was thinking only more succintly.  I couldn’t agree more.  I’m not an avid fan of the death penality unless it’s in cases or rape and molesting children.  This pig should be put down.

Goldfinch86
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 08:49 pm: [report]

@CheeeeEEEEse: My Father is retired and economically speaking putting someone to death costs far more than keeping them alive. I don’t remember numbers since it’s been a long time since I wrote a 40 page essay on the topic of the death penalty for college, so I’m pulling facts out of my ass. The state and government must pay more money out of pocket for the court fees and lawyers than it does to feed, clothe, house, medically care for a prisoners. I’m not some stupid daddies girl, I was merely stating a fact that is prison life. Also while I respect the feelings of those who are hurt by rape I do not feel that the death penalty is warranted.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 09:50 pm: [report]

@Goldfinch86: I’ve heard it quoted before that it’s cheaper to incarcerate prisoners rather than execute them….but to this day I still do not know why. Other that high legal fees, there should be no reason why killing someone shouldn’t be easy and cheap. I mean seriously, if there was that much money in keeping people alive rather that killing them I’d be killing people for the state and I’d take half of what they are paying now and do it regularly as a service.

Lilypie
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 09:54 pm: [report]

If you cut down on the number of appeals they get and stop housing them for 20+ years before following through on their sentences, killing would be cheap and easy.  @Cheese: I hope you include child molesters on your list of “violent criminals” when you’re Regent!

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on September 19 2009 @ 10:04 pm: [report]

@Lilypie: They are underlined already. Along with rapists and murders with multiple witnesses.

MissChaotic
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 12:42 am: [report]

Cheese…don’t forget to add the execs at AIG who took bailout money to fire employees and throw themselves a super lavish party. That is despicable.

Also, what did you have in mind for the heads of FEMA?

effing hickster
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 01:32 am: [report]

THIS IS NOT A STATEMENT ABOUT THE ARTICLE. IT IS A STATEMENT ABOUT THE RESPONSES.

As much as I don’t feel like it, I must agree with Marie MacCee.

With the prevalent numbers of people who are lately being vindicated and set free due to DNA evidence, the whole eye-for-an-eye code doesn’t seem to be a good solution in the long run.
Sure, there are quite a few people with overwhelming evidence against them who are getting what they deserve. However, all I can think of is that group of people in 1980’s Bakersfield, California (the daycare trials) who were railroaded in one of the largest witch hunts our justice system has ever seen.

I sure wouldn’t want to be one of those Hofstra kids either. If the police never got a confession from the girl, or even a video, you’d all be hollering for an execution. A lifetime of prison rape doesn’t seem like a fair exchange for getting crazy in a bathroom with a girl who tried to make up a lame excuse for what she did.

“It is better to risk saving a guilty man than to condemn an innocent one.”
Voltaire

effing hickster
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 01:37 am: [report]

Now here’s a statement about the article itself.

I think we should ponder less about the fate of a guilty man and more about how to prevent someone from taking advantage in the first place.

The chilling story seems to outweigh the main thrust of the article: Would this rapist have raped and killed so many more women had I simply told the truth instead of keeping it to myself?

Goldfinch86
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 12:16 pm: [report]

I think people got off topic and I couldn’t help but comment about what was said.
Her story was very sad and I felt she should have spoken out about it, but that was her choice based on her pain. She is certainly not to be blamed, and it’s too late to do anything about the women who were infected and who died, there is nothing to be gotten from her speaking out except helping her self. As she said in the article she feels speaking out will hurt others and because she feels others are more important, her confession in her writing is probably the closest she will ever get to speaking out.

karmadillo
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 12:23 pm: [report]

It’s hard to tell people when they don’t know how to respond to the information, or how having it in the open will effect your life. Also, at thirteen years old it’s not easy to be logical about such a traumatizing event. The first person I told was my first boyfriend after the fact. Response: “Uhh… should I get tested then?” Legitimate concern, but not the most sensitive approach to consoling an upset female. He then continued to ask if I had done anything to provoke it, as if flirting or dressing appealingly warrants an attack. Bottom line, people don’t always help the matter. Things do get better though. Knowing people who aren’t idiots helps.

Knitter79
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 01:03 pm: [report]

Good point, karmadillo.  A teenager’s brain doesn’t work the same way an adult’s brain does.  They are still developing and maturing.  I was attacked twenty years ago (pre-teen) and to this day have only told one other person.  I wasn’t raped, but I was terrified afterwards.  It’s easy to look back and think ‘I should have just said something’ but not so easy as a scared ten year old.

effing hickster
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 01:09 pm: [report]

@karmadillo: According to the 2000 U.S. Justice Department study of college age women, 2.8% had been raped, and of those, 90% knew their attackers. I would think knowing people who aren’t idiots helps a lot.

katnohat
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 09:47 pm: [report]

The chilling story seems to outweigh the main thrust of the article: Would this rapist have raped and killed so many more women had I simply told the truth instead of keeping it to myself?

1: she didn’t lie to anyone about anything.
2: it’s not her job to stop him, but his not to rape.

BeholdAUnicorn
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 10:36 pm: [report]

Thanks for posting this story; the writer was very brave to share her experiences and it’s definitely an eye-opener (though, as other people have pointed out, unfortunately her experiences and the indifference she was met with are not that rare).
I do have a problem with the stock photo you chose to illustrate the story with. It could be triggering for sexual assault victims—in other words, bringing back memories of their assaults.

effing hickster
wrote on September 20 2009 @ 11:42 pm: [report]

@katnohat: Okay, I’ll rephrase that: “told what happened”, but yes—she withheld information.

It may be his job not to rape, but he did rape, and fulfilled statistical prophecy by doing it again to others.

I hate to make it sound patronizing, but in a way it is her job to stop him. It’s everyone’s job to stop him. If an offender commits crime with no remorse, it is up to society to step in. That’s why we have a legal system.

She did tell her friend (and good on her), but the idiot friend simply replied “Oh honey, we’ve all been raped.” The other pretended not to hear. At this point, if she’d had an open dialogue with her parents through her childhood, she would have known enough to go to someone else she could trust, even if it wasn’t her parents. Just to move on down the line until she found someone to listen. The reason I say this is because abusers want us, EXPECT us, to be silent.

I know that I do come off sounding like a know-it-all on this forum most of the time. When I respond to the stories of sex and rape, many of my detractors think I don’t know jack about the subject because I’m a man…but I do.

It’s been thirty years since I was molested, and this is the first time I’ve felt enough indignation to tell my story on a public forum.

I was twelve, about to enter junior high. He was a family member, about five years older. He coerced me into performing oral sex on him over a six month period, threatening bodily harm if I didn’t cooperate. I believed him. My life with him had been one of constant verbal abuse; not the yelling, cussing kind, but the seething, malicious insults and threats behind the backs of adults who could step in if need be. Recently, the threats became random acts of physical abuse which were easily covered by a boys-will-be-boys facade. That, coupled with ultimatums to reveal information I wanted to keep secret, he had me in a corner. So I gave in to his demands.

I don’t remember how I came up with the courage to stop what I was doing, but I do remember telling him that he could hurt me all he wanted…I wasn’t going to do “that” anymore.
During this time, he had been causing enough trouble for himself and others that he was sent away for a few months. I was off the hook for the time being.
Unlike the author, I didn’t tell a soul. I didn’t tell anyone for years. How could a twelve-year-old heterosexual boy tell anybody about having to perform oral sex on another male without feeling a burning shame that knows no limits?
Now, I tell. For the past 20 years I’ve told anyone I think would benefit from my advice, adults and children alike. I tell them to keep an open dialogue with their kids, to educate them. Education about good and bad touch, power distribution and emotional blackmail, and if something does happen - not to give up until they find someone who will listen.
I repeat, parents should always keep an open dialogue with their kids, whether it involves sex education, or how to deal with coercion, power plays, and emotional blackmail.

Silence is never the answer.

jackofhearts
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 08:26 am: [report]

@majicksand

(and anybody else who has advocated the death penalty)

As a rape victim I can say that my rapist’s death would have made no iota of difference to me, the victim. Killing the perpetrator does not remove or assuage the trauma of the crime itself.

The man who raped me is in jail, and likely to remain there for a very long time. He can do no further harm.

It costs a huge amount of money and time to kill someone through due process. I think the money could be better spent in researching the underlying (mental/social) causes of rape in a civilised society and in funding victim support organisations.

SCRMOM
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 08:50 am: [report]

@eh:  I appreciate you sharing your story.  I’m sorry that this happened to you, and as a mother of three (including a boy near that age now), these stories not only break my heart but make my blood boil.  Because of those brave enough to tell their stories, changes are starting to happen.  For example, in our state, all school aged-children are taught the messages you mentioned above (good and bad touch, emotional blackmail, telling a trusted adult, etc.) in first grade and again, in fourth grade.  The parents are also given information on how to talk to their children about this.

katnohat
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 09:02 am: [report]

effing hickster: I feel for you. I too was a victim of rape. A guy I danced with at a Holloween party followed me back to where I was housesitting, and just walked in. I did not know that the lock on the front door was broken. It was my cousins house, she neglected to tell me that little fact. After i went to the hospital and was released, I went home , showered and went to work. Shock I guess. When I did fess up to what happened, (my cousin found blood and other stuff on her sheets) she denounced me to the entire family as a whore who had sex in her bed and was looking for a cover story. My own parents did not believe me. This happened in a small town outside of New Orleans, the guy that did this to me was related to half the police force, so nothing happened to him, while I was harrassed for years.(Don’t accuse someone of rape and drive 2 miles over the speed limit.) So, while in an ideal world, a vivtim I.D. or reporting her or his assult will stop a rapist or molester in his or her tracks, we live in the real world, where sometimes that just makes life unbearable.

retro chic
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 09:39 am: [report]

Sexual predators are a special breed where the rate of recidivism is virtually unredeemable. I’m very mixed on the death penalty. Add murder, these crimes definitely make my list for chemical execution. I am OK with that.
ps: I don’t like the term “Euthanasia.” That’s reserved for people who wish to die of their own accord, and deserved no punishment and committed no crime. Call the death penalty what it is: Execution by Lethal Injection, as the others said – put them down.

@ef: As for the untested DNA cases? They should be fast-tracked with the programs/projects in place to do so; there’s plenty of time for that during all the years of appeals and would save a lot of costs. The ones already confirmed with DNA matches must go.

One of the problems with the death penalty is the looming threat of it is not the threat it once was. I love old movies as a representation of that bygone era. A would-be killer says to his partner, “We don’t really need to kill him… just rough him up him. He dies, we’ll get The Chair, Sid – The Chair!” ‘Cause punishment was swift – you got executed within 30-60 days of sentencing. THAT was a deterrent.

majicksand
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 12:36 pm: [report]

As I said in my earlier post, I have no desire to defend my stance on this subject.  I will only say two things.

1. I am, like so many others, a victim.  I know how difficult it is to share that pain, and I applaude those who are able.  I understand those who cannot.

2. I was very careful to specify immediate implementation of the death penalty in cases which include irrefutable DNA evidence.  Given the recidivism rate, I consider lethal injection a method of prevention.  Sexual predators should never be allowed the opportunity to strike again.  Thirty years in prison just slows them down, and we all know the sentences are usually much shorter.  If one victim had the courage to step forward and get the perpetrator convicted, there should not be any more victims.

@hickster:  I’m so glad you found a way to end your abuse. 
I agree that we should, as parents, be pro-active in building strong enough bonds with our children that they feel comfortable confiding anything to us.  We must both also live with the uncomfortable reality that because we could not tell, our attackers may have found other victims.  I can only hope that the bond I’ve created is strong enough that my sons would come to me.

effing hickster
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 12:52 pm: [report]

I don’t want anyone to get me wrong, but I’m not for the death penalty. There’s always that chance that evidence can prove someone’s innocence somewhere down the road. We are lucky to have the legal system we have, but I do agree, it’s often misused.

BTW, I am that guy who keeps everyone stuck in court deliberations far longer than they think is appropriate, because I want to be damn sure of your innocence or guilt before I vote. If you ever wind up in court, cross your fingers that I’m on the jury, and not some jerk complaining about being away from work.

lareinedeslames
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 03:57 pm: [report]

I do applaud you, effing hickster, for sharing your experience.

Caveat: I am more on majick’s side, opinion-wise, than on yours, and jackofhearts’.

It may not make a difference to other victims, but for me, I’m not going to be satisfied that the person who molested myself and my brother is not going to do it again until he’s dead. He’s currently a convicted sex offender, because I didn’t speak up soon enough to prevent someone else from being victimized.

My mom has said that if she was diagnosed with terminal cancer, she would probably torture him and kill him. Hell, if *I* was diagnosed with terminal cancer, I’d probably do the same. There is, in my heart, a black hatred towards him that only subsides when I have no reason to think about him. I used to dream of killing him brutally.

Now, I dream about the possibility that one of those others parents takes matters into their own hands and ends his miserable life.

lareinedeslames
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 04:05 pm: [report]

....okay. ssparks, I’m going to really, really, really hope that you’re making some kind of extremely bad joke.

REALLY.

sportzriter13
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 04:13 pm: [report]

no such luck.
stats for rape are considered to be UNDER what is really going on. Why? victims don’t always report rape to the police because they are afraid no one will believe them. Sad to say, but with people like ssparks as potential jurors I’d be afraid too. Yes there are those who cry rape, but those are far fewer then 50% (where do you get your BS stats from anyway?) and are quickly outed by police. Those women have issues.
The only persons to blame for the “rape problem” are the scumbags that commit rape.

majicksand
wrote on September 21 2009 @ 04:21 pm: [report]

@lareinedeslames:  I’ve harbored a few torture fantasies of my own.  I tell people not to get me started, but, invariably, they have a twisted desire to hear what I’m capable of doing to another living soul under the right circumstances.  Amazingly, they are then shocked by the level of my depravity (I prefer to see it as dedication).

Honestly though, I don’t bother with those thoughts on my own behalf.  I can accept what happened to me, and I know that I am stronger for it.  If someone were to abuse one of my children?  All bets are off.  I would have to be sedated and restrained until that individual was safely behind bars.

@ssparks:  False accusations are punished.  Filing a false police report, slander suits, condemnation by everyone who finds out…  The blame for sexual assault lies entirely with the perpetrator, regardless of gender.  Comments like yours only serve to make it harder for people to come forward.  In any case where there isn’t clear, visible, quantifiable proof of attack, someone will always claim the victim is lying.  Even when there is DNA or bruising, the rapist will claim it was consentual (ie. she likes it rough or he just doesn’t want to admit he liked being with a guy)  I believe your statistics are inflated to say the least.  Sexual assault are more often not reported at all and lead to conviction even less.  A ‘not guilty’ verdict is <b>not</i> the same as innocent.

effing hickster
wrote on September 23 2009 @ 06:18 am: [report]

Here’s a definite example of why I’m slow to judge and convict. A family’s lives ruined over innocent photos.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfmoms/detail?entry_id=48024

majicksand
wrote on September 23 2009 @ 07:44 am: [report]

@hickster:  That situation is indeed sad.  It is not, however, what we’ve been discussing.  Sexual predators are an entirely different breed, and there is no ‘cure’ for their issues.