Marie Claire Debuts Plus-Size Style Column

GreenAura
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:41 am: [report]

BMI is a ridiculous, asinine scale.  It says Michael Jordan is overweight, go figure.  In order to calculate a true “ideal” weight, you need to take into account your height, weight, age, sex, bone structure, muscle-to-fat ratio and activity level.  The way I personally find my “ideal” weight is how I feel mentally and physically.  I feel great, so I must be ideal

shannac02
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:44 am: [report]

I SOOOOOOO need this chick to be my BFF. If her column is a monthly column, I might start subscribing to Marie Claire for the first time in my 25 years. Thank you to Glamour and Marie Claire for FINALLY realizing that not ALL women are a size 10 and under. Some of us big girls do wear clothes, and they’re cute, and they’re not sweatpants…

cadyms
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:46 am: [report]

I would love to see realistic exercise and nutrition info for plus-sized women in womens magazines.  I will never wear the cute spandex outfit they have on the exercise model.  I will not practice anything that requires me actually bringing the magazine to the gym so I can remember all the steps.  But - well, I do love to jog, but it’s hard on my knees.  And I have wider feet, which need arch support, so can you help me figure out which shoes are good options? 

But the day these issues will be dealt with reasonably is probably the same day authors will stop discussing, in a calm and caring tone and unfortunately condescending tone, their concern for Ms. Falcons’ health.

As long as there are fat women, there will be people kind enough to remind us of their concern for our health.  In case you didn’t realize, I actually see my body in the mirror everyday, so am quite aware of what size I am and the various health issues associated with it.

writergirl
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:49 am: [report]

Kind of along these lines on reflecting “real life women” I had the opportunity to meet the author Judi McCoy last night and aside from being funny as hell, she’s made a concerted effort to notmake any of her heroines a size 2.  All her heroines reflect the “average” size woman of at least a size 14.  She said she’s gotten flack from her editors and agents about it, but has refused to change how her heroines look.

I think if more women like Judi and magazines like Marie Clair promoted women looking like normal women and a healthy lifestyle, then more and more women would lose weight and actually get healthy.  There seems to be a pervasiveness in our culture that says you have to be a size 0-2 or nothing in this country.  This morning I was in White House Black Market looking at sweaters—one was a size XXS.  I have skinny, size 0 thirteen year old neices who couldn’t get one arm in that sweater.  Who are they kidding?

So when women see a sweater like that coupled with the size 0 model, they think, “Why bother?” and the cycle continues.

KatyInLasVegas
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:51 am: [report]

I was enjoying this article until I read “I can’t help but think about her health.” Really? Being concerned about the health of a plus-size model sounds incredibly condescending. I haven’t heard this kind of commentary as it pertains to skinny models. Talking about the health of a plus-size model is just as stupid as saying that you’re concerned with the health of every smoker you walk past on the street. Completely ludicrous. Such concerns about other people are not your problem.

As a plus-sized women, I’m more annoyed with the sympathy women display for plus-size models when magazines use them than how much face time they get on a magazine. At any size, I’m used to looking at ridiculously small models in magazines. While I can ignore them, I just hope I can teach my daughter to as well.

Catherine Strawn
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:58 am: [report]

@KatyInLasVegas: I have no idea whether Ashley is obese, but according to the CDC, she is. There are definitely other factors involved, and I was merely using this to bring up my point questioning whether should there should be plus-size fitness and nutrition information in magazines, as well. It’s hard to meet every different group’s needs, but plus-size women make up a large part of our population, and health is always a topic covered in women’s mags, just like fashion.

And, yes, I’m concerned about the health of smokers and too-thin models, as well.

H. Blue
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:59 am: [report]

Well-said cadyms. 

I am a size 14.  For the first time in my life, I feel beautiful, or at least attractive, most of the time.  But there are still countless people and statistics and arbitrary measures, like BMI, telling me otherwise. 
I once weighed almost 270lb, and was about a size 24.  I’m considerably less than that now, but although I’m so very proud of my achievements in improving my health, I won’t post my current weight here.

I eat better and excerise more than a lot of people I know who are thinner than I am.  But there are people who would be more than happy to judge me based on my size, the number on the scale, and my BMI which still puts me in the obese category. (thankfully, I’m no longer considered morbidly obese) 

While it is condescending to assume that every overweight person participates in very unhealthy habits, a lot of us do, and it’s a shame.  Even though I don’t fit into the societal “ideal” I feel better than I’ve ever felt before, because of the healthy choices I make.  I wish that there was a way to get more people to be healthier, while at the same time not making them feel like they’re being asked to conform to some skinny model mold.  Because no matter your size, it feels really good to be good to your body.

JenniferRly
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:05 am: [report]

I’m excited about this new interest in including varied body types in magazines, but somehow I still feel left out.  It sounds stupid, but I’m in the middle (like most women in their 20’s, I think), and though I can’t wear the size 0, size 14 fashion advice doesn’t help me either.

I know I don’t need a magazine to dress myself, but a little advice for the size 6’s out there would be nice…

amandabear
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:06 am: [report]

@KatyInLasVegas: “Being concerned about the health of a plus-size model sounds incredibly condescending.” I totally agree. I actually find that sort of comment condescending almost every time I hear it. It’s like fat people shouldn’t be allowed to actually feel good about themselves, because OH GOD, what about their health? Think of the children! Please. Fat doesn’t equal unhealthy anymore than thin equals healthy, and even if it did, health itself is a personal issue and frankly not anyone’s business.

But I’ll step off my soap box now and say I’m excited to see something like this in a mainstream magazine like Marie Claire, and I’ll definitely be picking up the November issue.

cadyms
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:08 am: [report]

@Catherine - Perhaps you didn’t intend it to come across as condescending, but your “concern” about Ms. Falcon’s health most definitely comes across that way to me.  That concern is the polite covering that society uses to say to women of a certain size, “no, no, we care about you.  We don’t think ill of you.  We’re just concerned about your health.” 

Unless you are an obesity researcher, I would bet good money that most overweight women are more well read and more well educated on issues of weight, food, exercise, etc. than even you. 

You had a great point, but that “concern” made it hard for me to even get through it to reach that point.

joyy
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:09 am: [report]

@cayms - I’ve got flat feet and have always struggled to find decent support in shoes.  The best I’ve done is arch supports from the goodfeet store (http://www.goodfeet.com).  They aren’t cheap (mine were about $200 I think), but I’ve been wearing the same pair for almost 10 years now and they’re still going strong.

@KatyinLasVegas - word.  One of the fittest people in my office (a late 30something mother of 2 who has a black belt in something and runs half-marathons) had open heart surgery last year.  BMI is not an indicator of good health and quite frankly, I’m more worried about anyone (like the Frisky staff!) who cop to guzzling diet coke nonstop on a daily basis than I am about people whose BMIs are higher than my own. 

You would probably enjoy Penn & Teller’s #&@$% episode on obesity where they have people throught the BMI scale compete in various events and one of the overweight guys is fitter than even the normal BMI dude.  I think they should have lent more legitimacy to diabetes, the rapid rise in obesity rates, etc, but they do a pretty decent job showing that at the very least, where you fall on the BMI scale doens’t have that much to do with how healthy or fit you are.

cadyms
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:13 am: [report]

@joyy - Thanks for the Penn&Teller; info - that’s a great series.  My resting heart rate is 45, my cholesterol is in the super low range, and my blood pressure is normal.  Not bad for 31 and obese.

Annika Harris
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:15 am: [report]

@joyy Actually, all of us don’t guzzle Diet Coke, and some of us don’t even drink soda.

betty123
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:16 am: [report]

The health issues regarding obesity are definitely important, no doubt, and overall health for all demographics of women should be covered in magazines where this subject matter is addressed. However, this is a style column, and putting health/nutrition info in there would water down the focus of the column. Whether it is healthy or not, this is a large sector of the population that deserves to be acknowledged as worthy of dressing with style, especially since the plus sized body is a tricky one to dress. I think that this kind of column can have only positive repercussions by giving plus size women the know how to dress their bodies in a way that best flatters their figure, bringing them confidence and making them feel as beautiful as they truely are. Perhaps this confidence will be the first step that gives them confidence in other areas of their life, leading to healthy life decisions all around, which might mean taking care of physical health by losing weight or just having the mental health to deal with the haters that might not appreciate them for the rock stars they are.

joyy
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:17 am: [report]

@cadyms - not bad for anyone, hon.  I’m a size 6, in fairly good shape, and my heartrate isn’t nearly that low and I have NO idea where my cholestorl is.  And if you end up looking into those arch supports, go to a store, don’t buy over the internet.

cadyms
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:24 am: [report]

I think the author (unfortunately for her) accidentally hit a nerve.  I’m not usually so vocal on one topic, but I think I have been more hurt by society’s reaction to my weight than by the weight itself.

At 6 I knew I was chubby.  At 10 I cried before every gym class.  At 16 I was running 5 miles a day and starving myself to try and get skinny.  At 18, I was malnourished and the skinniest I would ever see in my adult life - a size 6, 150 pounds.  I’ve been laughed at, made fun of, stuck my head in a toilet bowl of weight. 

When people express concern for my health, or want to give me advice - I think, this issue is so much more personal and complicated than you have any idea. If it was just eat right and exercise, you’d have a lot fewer ppl with weight issues.

jubee
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:28 am: [report]

@JenniferRly

You took the words right out of my mouth, not being model skinny but not being “the avg size 14” by average the middle of what all American woman are, its a bit frustrating, its hard to find high fashion in a size 8 but I don’t necessarily need to find the best plus sized jeans either, i would like fashion advice for all kinds of American women.

Lauren Fritsky
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:56 am: [report]

Amen, JenniferRly. I have felt this way since I hit puberty. The normal-sized are overlooked.

I think part of the reason columns like this hit nerves is because this country has begun to look at size as being relative. As everyone gets bigger, “normal” gets bigger. If you’re a size 14, but all your friends are 20+, they might call you “thin” because you’re smaller than them. But if you stand next to a size 4, you’ll feel fat. This thinking is distorting our perceptions of what is healthy. The fact remains that BMI, waist measurements, body fat percentage and weight are indicators of a healthy size, not that you may be smaller than overweight or obese people around you.

joyy
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:05 pm: [report]

@annika - good to hear, guess ‘frisky staff’ implied every single one of you unnecessarily!  I was thinking of the soda tax/how will it affect your DC habit post a while back, in case you were wondering.

emflow
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:14 pm: [report]

The article specifically says Marie Claire is running a plus size FASHION COLUMN. So I don’t see where exercise or nutrition would fit into that. There are plenty of resources for women of all sizes who want to change their appearance or become healthier - this is not the content of a fashion column.

But I think this highlights tendency to tie every aspect of a plus-size persons’ life to their weight - more specifically to what’s “wrong” with plus-size people, or how we should change to be “better.” The problem with inserting diet/exercise information into a fashion column is that it’s essentially another voice coming from a supposedly supportive place and saying “you need to change to be acceptable.”

I personally don’t understand why people think more information is going to suddenly make the overweight 2/3 of the population jump up and change overnight.
My take on this is: Weight loss, exercise, and deciding to live a healthy life is all very personal decisions and connected to habits, economics, and sense of self-worth. Continual information about weight loss sends the message that if you’re overweight and not losing weight (or even if you are losing weight but not achieving some ideal), you’ve failed. Information meant to be helpful then turns into a pervasive negative message that impacts self-confidence and self-worth. In my case (and I suspect for many other people), lower sense of self-worth means poor health choices and reinforced bad habits.

I have mixed feelings about the fat acceptance movement. But a major argument for it is that people who feel good about themselves are far, far more likely to live healthy, full lives, regardless of size.

bumbler
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:17 pm: [report]

Wait, wait.  If larger and middle sizes can’t find their size in stores, I’m a very small size and only see my size on the runway, nowhere I could actually purchase them.  Then what sizes are stores selling??

Lynn
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:34 pm: [report]

No, I don’t think there should be any mention of diet/exercise in a plus-size style column. That would be ridiculous. If MC wants to cover health in other parts of the magazine, that’s fine. But honestly I don’t even know if they do - I think of it as a style magazine above anything else. I mean, I don’t pick up Shape and expect to see shots from the latest runway show.

Totally outside of the argument about whether that weight is healthy or not, or whether we should be worried about people’s weight or not, I think it’s perfectly acceptable to write a column that will tell plus-size women how to flatter themselves with their clothes - whether they plan on losing weight, gaining weight, or staying steady. If she IS unhealthy (and I’m not joining the argument of whether or not she is) that doesn’t have anything to do with her right to put on clothes that make her feel good. If your friend wanted to know how to dress around a cast, would you refuse to help her feel pretty because putting herself in a situation to break her leg was an unhealthy decision? No.

Humble Bee
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:35 pm: [report]

@Bimbler, do you really want someone to answer that?
*rolls eyes*

Quizshow
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:41 pm: [report]

@emflow - my thoughts exactly.  Why would a fashion magazine need to interject health & fitness advice into fashion tips for plus-size ladies?  It’s a back handed compliment: Yes, we’re recognizing that there a lot of plus-size fashionistas, but we still think your size is unacceptable.  Where are the health tips for the skinny coffee and cigarettes crowd?  Personally, I find it demeaning and small-minded to think that overweight people need constant reminders to lose weight. I’ve got my stack of fitness mags, now tell me where to get good jeans that don’t exaggerate my muffin top.

bumbler
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:48 pm: [report]

@Humble Bee why wouldn’t it seem strange that a wide selection of women of various sizes are having a hard time finding clothes in their size in clothing stores? Seems to be a legitimate concern for many of us here trying to find stylish, age appropriate clothes that fit.

And *rolls eyes*?  Really?  Would you like to add some finger snaps as well to show me what you really feel?

Humble Bee
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 01:39 pm: [report]

yeah, cause’ in a plus-sized article we all wanted to know that you can only find your size on the runway…. lol. *snaps fingers AND rolls eyes*
-happy?

bumbler
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 01:46 pm: [report]

@Humble Bee hmmm I’m not seeing this kind of anger towards the posters of other sizes who complained about not being able to find their size although they’re far from plus sized themselves.  You only take issue with me..interesting.  I can only concluded that your bitterness has nothing to do with me personally instead with your own issues and end the conversation with that.

Back to my point-  All the fashion blogs and columns in the world won’t make a difference if women can’t find affordable and cute clothing options in their size.  While it’s great that other sizes are being highlighted in magazines I don’t see this doing a whole lot for women of any size until the stores catch up and realize women don’t come in 3 similar sizes (10,12 and 14 in my experience).  Sure a column can tell you that boyfriend jeans and tailored jackets may work best on your frame but what difference does it make if you can never find any?

Humble Bee
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 01:53 pm: [report]

lol. I don’t have anything against you. That comment just rubbed me the wrong way, just like how Catherine said she was concerned about their health and everyone jumped on her because it sounded condescending, its the same here. I felt like you meant, ‘I’m concerned for you because you can’t find your fat ass size, and I can’t find my “runway” size’. It kind of had this negative connotation to it. You probably didn’t mean it that way at all, so I’ll apologize for taking your words out of context and run along now.

fallonthecity
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 01:55 pm: [report]

@Catherine: here’s what we like to call folks like you: concern trolls.

I’m so sick of “This is a step in the right direction! But while we’ve got the opportunity to talk to fat people….. won’t you remember to LOSE WEIGHT?  Really we care about you, and here are some diet tips… even though we don’t know anything about you or your personal habits!  Being thin gives me the authority to lecture you on your health, even though I am not a doctor or nutritionist!”

I would try to write something coherent about this, but I see a few commenters above have got it covered.  C’mon, Frisky writers, get a clue.  Fat people know what’s up—even the unhealthy ones.  Stop acting like having a big woman person in a magazine will make everyone in America start mainlining lard.

fallonthecity
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 01:57 pm: [report]

*“big woman”, not “big woman person.”

...eesh.

Catherine Strawn
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 02:05 pm: [report]

I did not say that I think she needs to lose weight. I was merely wondering whether magazines will expand the stories geared specifically to plus-size women to areas outside fashion, i.e., health and nutrition, in the future.

remembercedricdiggory
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:04 pm: [report]

@Humble Bee; I think bumbler was simply making a funny comment about how so many of us can’t find things in our sizes… She didn’t really express concern...but alas, now we retreat. =)

emflow
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:14 pm: [report]

@ Catherine
That’s the thing - there are a TON of sources telling plus-size people about nutrition and exercise. It gets insulting when anything having to do with life as a plus-size person automatically goes straight to a discussion of exercise and nutrition.  Her health is her business - she’s doing an article on fashion, let’s talk about her fashion sense not her health.

bumbler
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:23 pm: [report]

@remembercd Yes, thank you.  As someone who spends the half hour following a Wii Active workout sprawled on her living room floor trying to catch her breath I’m the last person to express concern over other people’s health.  I’m one of the least in shape people I know of any size.  I don’t know how my comment exactly expressed any concern, of course if anyone is actually experiencing health problems I’m always sorry to hear about it but equating size and size alone with health is a major leap.  I’m living proof of that one.

Catherine Strawn
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:23 pm: [report]

@ emflow: There are a ton of sources telling “normal” size women about nutrition and exercise, too, yet magazines still cover these topics every month.

emflow
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:32 pm: [report]

@ Catherine
Yup. And a column about plus-size exercise and nutrition might be a very good thing to have in Marie Claire. But you chose to spontaneously bring that up in your article rather than focusing on the existing fashion column. That is what I take issue with.

Casper
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 05:03 pm: [report]

Plus size girls are permanently getting health advice shoved at them, why can’t we have a column that’s all about fashion and no ‘go eat an apple and walk round the block’ for once? For me, at a size 20/22uk depending on the cut and style i realize that I’m in the obese category and i realize the health risks that go along with that, but funnily enough I’m still this size while I’m trying to lose the weight and i still want to feel good about the way i look. I’m not going to just wake up one day and be thin, it takes work and a lot of time so a fashion column that does cater to my size is always welcome without the health advice. I get why you’d think adding health advice would be a good thing and helpful though, but for once all i want is some good advice on what will suit my body shape. And you never know, she could be eating salads and walking to work and still be the size she is. I was always chubbs as a teen, yet i biked and swam and walked a lot.

ChickenDinnerCandyBar
wrote on October 12 2009 @ 07:06 pm: [report]

@ Catherine

I don’t think talking about her health is relevant AT ALL. I have never seen any fashion article about a thin girl where her health is mentioned. 

Your comment (“I can’t help but think about her health.”) IS condescending. You are saying that because she is fat she is unhealthy.

I understood what you were trying to say about having size-specific health information in fashion magazines. I see you were using that to lead into that discussion. But why digress to begin with? The topic was plus size girls in fashion, not about if there should be supplemental articles in magazines for their size type.

BiancaDivine
wrote on October 14 2009 @ 08:25 pm: [report]

Wow—I thought I’d finally come out of “lurk-status” to leave a comment on one of sex-oriented postings (meowww), but I just had to register (finally) so that I can leave my $.02. As a plus-size chick, I can’t tell you all how much I despite being reminded about my “health”. What’s interesting, is that the so-called worry about my “health” seems to be the last-gasp argument that being fat is just not right. As in: “You’re fat, and that’s bad.” Nope, it’s not: I’ve got a healthy love life (sex life, meowww), work life, personal life, and I don’t give a damn anymore if people can’t accept the fact that I’m proud of myself and not a size 2.

“But your health!,” the well-meaning nobody still will proclaim. “It’s just not healthy being that fat!” What’s not healthy, is dealing with a culture that glorifies a standard that most women simply cannot (or don’t want to) achieve. Guess what? You can take your kind thoughts of my health, and keep them to yourself. It’s a FASHION column; if they discuss health, so be it, but please take your sanctimonious concern and… simply keep it to yourself.

And I don’t know WHAT is up with these women who bemoan the fact that there are articles for plus-size women, articles for skinny women, but none which address the concerns of “women in between”? What the hell? Don’t all these magazines also apply to women who are, say, size 6-10? Am I missing something?

Criminy.