Is It OK To Wear Fur If It’s Vintage?

melissaann
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 07:41 am: [report]

Maybe the girls you saw who looked warm and chic were wearing vintage? Maybe yours will look like a fresh kill? I think just the look of a fur piece conveys the idea you are okay with cruelty, because no one can know if it was vintage or not. But my views may be more extreme than others.

Claireific
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 07:43 am: [report]

I have a vintage mink stole too, made in the 50’s. It is a bit of a toss up, since on one hand, I wasn’t even alive when those minks were killed, but then some could say that by wearing vintage furs you’re supporting and lending visibility to the modern fur market.

Emi
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 07:49 am: [report]

I would never wear fur, even it were vintage. I wouldn’t be able to get the idea out of my head that I’m wearing what was once an animal draped around my shoulders. Even faux fur makes me cringe to touch. lol

VannaMarie
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:00 am: [report]

I myself have a few pieces of fur… and a piece of ivory. Each came from a special place, long, long ago. For instance, the ivory piece came from my grandfather from a someone he met overseas while serving in WWII. I love them all, and also am a huge animal lover. Like you, I feel that each has an air of romanticism and I view them as beautiful pieces of history. While I am not comfortable buying fur new, I wear/display each of my current pieces proudly. While I understands the viewpoints as listed above, I simply think it is a shame to let such pieces rot away somewhere not to be recognized for their beauty!

_jsw_
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:08 am: [report]

Not wearing it won’t bring the animal back from the dead. Wearing it makes you feel good. So wear it.

While I’m also opposed to killing animals merely for their fur, I don’t see any enormous difference between wearing fur, wearing leather, or eating meat. I wear leather and I eat meat, so I can’t really say much about people wearing fur except that it usually involved killing many animals for one item of clothing without using anything else from the body.

Within the next decade or so, we’ll be cloning fur and creating it without any need to kill animals, so this whole ethical debate will end soon enough.

VannaMarie
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:28 am: [report]

Oops… I meant “While I understand”, not “While I understands”...

bethlynn00
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:28 am: [report]

I don’t have any problems with people wearing fur, I’m sure that if animals and people traded places, you;d see a lion walking around in a human coat, that’s just the way it is.  My whole problem is that I have never seen anyone in fur who did not look really aged by wearing it! I think fur adds at least 10 years to your face.  My mom had this very lux fur coat for years and whenever she wore it ,I just thought she looked way older than she really was, it was very soft though and warm! If I wasn’t worried about looking so old I’d rock the hell out of a fur coat in the winter, it’s cold in WI! But I say if you like it, wear it. If they don;t kill an animal for fur, they’ll probably kill it for meat, either way it dies, why should that hinder your sense of fashion?

brandyalexander
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:36 am: [report]

Resident vegan speaking here. 
I have to say I am a little torn. 
From a utilitarian point of view, the animal is already dead, you aren’t killing her more by wearing her skin again. 
However, you are perpetuating the view that fur is acceptable and desirable, especially since you seem to be pretty stylish from what I can tell on this site. 
Since you’re feeling some guilt, I’d say go with your conscience and donate it.  There are great places to donate fur to make coats for the homeless.  This is really nice because it keeps them warm while dismantling the myth that fur is only for the glamorous.  There is also a group that uses fur to make teddy bears for kids in war-torn countries.  Let me do some research and get back to you, Erin. 
ps- Haha, just had an incredible idea.  Use the fur to make a point.  Wear it for Halloween, pretend to be Anna Wintour.  Get a bob wig, and some big glasses, and douse yourself in red paint.  Or be a cavewoman!  Fabulous!

Perceptible
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:37 am: [report]

Hmmmm… vintage or not, it’s a dead thing you’re wearing that died for no good reason so I’m out. That said, there are so many awesome FAKE fur pieces that are also washable! And some you can’t even tell are fake. So if you have fur on the brain, why not try a fake fur piece and everybody wins!

brandyalexander
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:47 am: [report]

OK, so I can’t quite find all the links I promised, but look!  The humane society will take your old fur and give it to an orphaned wild animal.  The fur becomes a sort of surrogate mother for the baby to cuddle with. 
Also, the fur for the homeless thing is from PETA
And a quick reminder for those of you who think killing animals for their fur is okay.

joyy
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:51 am: [report]

@jsw - //Not wearing it won’t bring the animal back from the dead. Wearing it makes you feel good. So wear it.

While I’m also opposed to killing animals merely for their fur, I don’t see any enormous difference between wearing fur, wearing leather, or eating meat.//

Am I your long lost daughter?  I agree completely.

joyy
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:55 am: [report]

@brandy - killer costume idea!

_jsw_
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:57 am: [report]

@brandyalexander: I love your links. Really. The orphaned wild animals one was fantastic and seems like a great way to recover some karma. And the PETA links were predictably depressing but worthwhile… and I’m not a fan of the vast majority of PETA’s actions, but some of their work is definitely eye-opening and important.

_jsw_
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 08:59 am: [report]

@ joyy: It’s completely possible. There was a time in college I drank so much I lost about an hour of memory. If you resulted from that, I’d love it because that would mean I lost my virginity for something worthwhile, not with someone I barely knew in my parents’ basement a few years later.

Well, it’d still have been with someone I barely knew, but it wouldn’t have been in my parents’ basement while my entire family was home.

delovely
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 09:25 am: [report]

I think vintage fur is fine. Here’s a vintage website that sells fur pieces from the 50’s/60’s: http://www.dandelion-vintage.com

brandyalexander
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 09:32 am: [report]

@ Joyy: Literally!  (getting off vegan soy high horse, getting back to work…)

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 09:58 am: [report]

Awesome comic is awesome:
http://www.explosm.net/comics/1827/

Taurwen
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 10:31 am: [report]

I don’t really feel bad for the animal, minks and the like are vicious little creatures. I just don’t like the way fur looks. Feels great, but I don’t really understand why you wouldn’t just put it on the inside of a coat when it looks gross (sorry) on the outside.

I don’t really understand the idea of the fake fur idea either. If the issue is that you’re perpetuating the idea that fur is fashionable and good by wearing a vintage fur coat, doesn’t wearing a fake fur coat that looks indistinguishable from real fur doing exactly the same thing?

Audi
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 02:26 pm: [report]

@Taurwen: So it’s okay to treat animals inhumanely if they’re “vicious little creatures?” Come on, don’t be an idiot; if you’re going to advocate wearing fur then at least do so with logical arguments.

I actually have no problem with wearing vintage fur (I own some myself), simply because it exists and it’d be a useless waste not to. However, I also think the fur industry is a relic of a more ignorant era in which it was possible to ignore or be completely unaware of wastefulness and cruelty, and that’s an era we don’t live in anymore. To buy new fur is to do so with blatent disregard for the most basic ethical considerations, and that just makes you sort of an a**hole.

Taurwen
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 02:37 pm: [report]

Oh no, I’m sorry for the misunderstanding, I just meant I wasn’t going to swayed by cute and cuddly argument. Nor the one that said the animals never did anything to you. Since I’ve been bitten by many many animals (I worked briefly at a wild life rehabilitation center. And have saved many wild animals before/after that period), I know the fact that they never did anything to me is because they never got the chance.

Queen Frostine
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 02:55 pm: [report]

Does anyone else here have extreme anxiety about wearing faux fur pieces? I have some great items that are 100% fake, but can fool the eye. But every time I wear them, it’s like a small part of me panics about some PeTA nut job going crazy on me from out of nowhere.

Audi
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 02:58 pm: [report]

@Taurwen: Ah, that makes a lot more sense. I hate the ‘cute and cuddly’ argument too, like when people are ok with rats being used for cruel and unecessary scientific experiments but not ok with bunnies or dogs.

Taurwen
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 02:59 pm: [report]

exactly, the double standard bothers me a lot. Especially when a lot of animals that are considered uncute (like rats) are very intelligent animals that just happen to have common conception pitted against them.

_jsw_
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 03:00 pm: [report]

@Queen Frostine: I don’t get the “throwing paint”/“destroy the fur” thing at all. I get that those crazies don’t care about the legal implications of destruction of property, but what I don’t understand is that even their tiny brains must somehow be able to process the concept that the owner of the fur they destroy is likely to go buy a new one, thus increasing the demand for fur.

bumbler
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 03:16 pm: [report]

Not really relevant but just to clear something up, when I was in high school AP bio classes used mink bodies from fur farms for dissection.  There are some uses for the bodies.  I’m not taking a stance on either fur wearing or dissection for that matter, just adding another fact to the debate.

MarieMacCee
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 03:52 pm: [report]

@brandyalexander

amazing costume idea and links-I don’t always love PETA (like when they blamed the jockey for Eight Belles’ death) but that was a great link and its a great idea.

As for the fur thing, I inherited a knee length fur coat from my grandmother who was a very important figure in my life and I absolutely treasure it. I almost never wear it because I’m too worried about something happening to it, but I don’t feel bad when I do (because of the grandmother link). On the other hand, I have never ever felt the urge to buy a new fur piece because I hate the idea of such waste and cruelty. I think that recycling old furs is a good way to enjoy the luxe feel of fur, and it’s the only way I would ever consider wearing it. And in my case, the coat is a just reminder of a dear family member who was known for her expensive taste, not a Fancy Fur Coat.

Audi
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 03:55 pm: [report]

@_jsw_: Fantastic point. The problem is that a lot of fervent animal activists (or any overly-fervent activists, for that matter) simply don’t understand how to persuade using logic and reason. When I was at U of MN some animal rights morons broke in and let a bunch of animals loose from one of the research labs, only to have them end up as roadkill within hours of setting them ‘free.’ They also destroyed a bunch of in vitro experiments set up in petri dishes, which of course has nothing to do with animal rights (unless you consider microbes to be animals, in which case the activists murdered them). My point is that many of these people act out of passion or hate, rather than out of genuine concern for the animals’ well-being. I’m sure none of them really think about the consequences beyond the initial act.

@bumbler: Wow, I’ve never heard of that being done before. I guess it’s better than just tossing the carcasses, but then again the schools can, and do, use the bodies of animals that are put down at local pounds. That’s what I dissected in college, anyway.

bumbler
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 04:41 pm: [report]

@Audi we did fetal pigs, crayfish and a ton of others in college.  I have to say that while any dissection for a high school student is pretty gross (I had to do a mud puppy as well) the skinless minks were like something out of a horror movie.  There was a lot of immature squealing that day.

Jessica
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 06:15 pm: [report]

I wear silk, leather, shearling, wool and fur, all natural fibers from animals. I eat meat, eggs, cheese and other food products from animals. Since I eat and wear all these animal products, I believe it consistent to wear fur. There is a great tour of a fur auction and mink farm at
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=115907&id=707803534&l=3871431c68

Arsenic
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 07:04 pm: [report]

Were I to be killed for my meat or skin I would much rather it be treasured and handed down as a heirloom than thrown in the trash.

JennyPurr
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 07:30 pm: [report]

Does anyone else here have extreme anxiety about wearing faux fur pieces? I have some great items that are 100% fake, but can fool the eye. But every time I wear them, it’s like a small part of me panics about some PeTA nut job going crazy on me from out of nowhere.

I’ve been wondering the same thing.  Wearing faux nervously is not a cute look.  What to do?

Anniushka
wrote on October 27 2009 @ 09:22 pm: [report]

I bought myself a rabbit fur-lined bomber hat for winter a few months ago and have been feeling conflicted over it ever since. I wanted something warm—this wasn’t for fashion’s sake, you understand—and I hate the feel of faux fur/faux shearling, and this one was on sale for something ridiculous like $20… but still. It’s fur. Some rabbits in China died for that hat (well, maybe only one… it’s just a hat), and who knows how humanely they were raised or how much of their bodies went to waste after the skin/fur was taken off. Rabbits are used for food; hopefully all that potential food didn’t go waste, you know? Especially in a place where good nutrition is harder to come by. If all fur operations used the bodies of the animals for food—at least animal food, since people aren’t probably going to want to eat mink meat—then I would probably feel much differently about it. The farms would probably have to abide by a lot more regulations if they did that, though…

On a related note, it seems to me like there’s a big ethical difference between, say, shearling and fur. Like, no PETA protesters throw red paint on Ugg boots, only fur coats and stuff. Is it because shearling comes from farm animals that are raised for purposes other than fur (like meat)? That’s how most leather is produced, too, isn’t it? I mean, if you can make two products out of the dead animal you’ve got in front of you, instead of just one, you’ll do it, right? That makes sense. I really hope that’s how it works. I hope most of the animals that are killed are made into leather as well as food. (I guess that depends on how special a hide has to be to be high-quality enough for tanning and sale. It’d suck if the hides of most of the animals that were killed just got thrown out because they didn’t pass muster with the tanner. I hate waste.) I love genuine leather and I would hate to feel conflicted about that, too…

Point being, if you’re going to kill the animal anyway, show it enough respect (at least symbolic respect) not to throw out more of its useful bits than absolutely necessary. And of course raise it and kill it humanely, but that goes without saying.

End ramble.

brandyalexander
wrote on October 28 2009 @ 08:06 am: [report]

@audi and jsw: Keep in mind that not all vegans throw paint/free animals from labs.  When you understand what happens in fur farms and laboratories, then you understand the impetus towards those actions. However, in my point of view, its a pretty futile action.  Like you said, J, that person is going out to buy another coat.  And perhaps even worse than those lab animals being hit by cars is the knowledge that they are getting replaced by more animals (although I do know of beagles rescued from labs by ALF who were later given to loving homes, not smashed by semis…).
Logic is the way to go when considering the problem and when discussing the issue.  I think the main concern most people have towards fur is that it is unnecessary and serves only vanity, therefore its a cruel and wanton act to kill an animal for vanity alone.
As a vegan, though, I would have to argue that the vast majority of animals die for a similar reason.  Because people do not need meat in order to live, we kill animals for their taste alone, which is as bad as killing them for the way their fur looks.  I’ve been vegan for ten years and am healthy and beautiful proof that meat is unnecessary.  So yes, if it was up to me, people wouldn’t be eating hamburgers or wearing those ugggggly uggs either.

brandyalexander
wrote on October 28 2009 @ 08:09 am: [report]

Wow, got kinda carried away and forgot my initial point to Audi and JSW was that the only reason the paint-throwers and ALF types come to mind is because they are the loudest.  They make up a very tiny portion of the population.  In my ten years in the animal rights community, I have never ever met anyone who was involved in such actions. Cheers to your friendly local vegan who persuades with gently dispensed logic and yummy yummy vegan food.

clearbluesky
wrote on October 28 2009 @ 02:34 pm: [report]

I have to remember an odd situation I witnessed in the subway last winter—a group of teenagers who were obviously outraged at the fur coat of a wealthy looking (and totally oblivious) woman in her 60’s. Only thing was it was faux fur.