Girl Talk: Is It Evil To Talk A Friend Out Of Getting Married?

SCRMOM
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:36 am: [report]

“I would be doing both of them a big favor” - hmmm, you really don’t know this.  I think this is one of those MYOB situations.

Raugiel
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:38 am: [report]

For my two cents, if I were the bride, I’d rather not get married than be fooled into thinking my groom-to-be was ready for marriage, only to end up divorced shortly down the road because he wasn’t. Your actions fit into MY girl code, any day.

writergirl
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:39 am: [report]

But I can’t help but think if I talk him out of this —spending all that money! (very likely) cheating on her! (very likely) getting divorced!—I would be doing both of them a big favor.

Maybe so.  But the fact is, unless he actively seeks your advice, the only thing you can do is bite your tongue.

bethlynn00
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:43 am: [report]

Yeah I would stay out of this one.  Your friend kinda sounds like a bit of a douche, like you should never feel obligated to marry someone and it sounds like with every relationship he thinks he has so many “other options”, when it sounds like none of his other options have worked out yet.  Let them make their own mistakes and deal with the aftermath and later when he’s lamenting all his grief about his divorce, then you can tell him, ” I knew it wasn’t going to work.” Besides if he knows his parents don’t agree and he has his own reservations, I doubt that anything you say will even make a difference.

Perceptible
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:45 am: [report]

That’s a tough situation for sure. I have a policy of not meddling in friends’ relationships myself, though at this point most of my friends are married and contemplating divorce.

That said, I WISH someone had tried to talk me out of getting married at 23! I believe I had subliminal doubts but once you’re on the train to marriage-ville, it’s hard to get off unless someone else derails it. My marriage lasted 10 miserable years and I’ll never get my 20s back.

The fact is, there’s a 50/50 chance his marriage will end in divorce anyway. And that’s for people who are SURE about the person they’re marrying. If he’s not sure, he’s not ready.

And I second what Raugiel said. If my groom-to-be were unsure, I’d rather know BEFORE we both said “I do!”

Jamie Lee
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:45 am: [report]

after i got divorced, i had quite a few members of my family and almost all of my friends say, yeah well we never thought you should have married him anyway, we all thought it was heading straight to the big D…wow i really wish someone would have told me how they felt and the reasons why, because i was really confused about it myself, and it would have saved me a ton of tears, heartache, stress, and oh yeah MONEY ... if you think a wedding is expensive, try an effing divorce….

lea322
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:47 am: [report]

Mind your own business? Are you kidding me? Whether he is going to cheat on her is something you can’t know, but what you DO know is what he’s told you: that he wants to push the date back, that he wants to explore other options, and that he is insecure and not ready for marriage (that one’s more implied). He is telling you that he is NOT ready to get married to anyone. Maybe you don’t need to explicitly tell him to break off his engagement, but you SHOULD encourage him to get to the bottom of his issues and decide what he really wants BEFORE he hurts his fiance in a much more damaging way than wasting money on a dress.

skywalk
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:47 am: [report]

I wouldn’t say it was evil and almost everyone I know does That said, I don’t typically (I don’t think I ever have actually) say anything because I don’t give relationship advice because they will never listen to it or it will back fire.  Unless my friend was being abused I wouldn’t say a word!

delovely
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:48 am: [report]

He’s a grownass man and she’s a grownass woman. They can make their own decisions and they deal with the consequences of those decisions.

joyy
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:48 am: [report]

I kind of want to try to talk an acquaintence out of her engagement to one of my bf’s friends.  I know him better than I know her though, so it’s realllly awkward.  He’s abusive, she’s kind of submissive, overall I can’t imagine her actually being happy married to such an abusive, psychotic douchebag.  But.  She probably wouldn’t listen and the only outcome would really be that I’d become (once again) the target of this wackjob’s insanity.  So I’m keeping my nose out and my fingers crossed.  They’re both in their 30s - they’re big enough to make their own decisions and mistakes.  Your friend might be younger, but it sounds like this is the kind of thing he’s going to have to figure out for himself.

qnzmami718
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:49 am: [report]

i think its also in the Code of Girl to help a sister out, and the reality is that in trying to help your friend, youre doing his fiancée a HUGE favor!

amandabear
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:50 am: [report]

It does sound like a bad situation just waiting to get worse, and personally, if I were his girlfriend, I’d want to know that he was feeling so lukewarm about the whole thing. Marrying someone because you don’t want to hurt their feelings is ridiculous. But, that said, it’s a tough call as to whether you should get involved. Conventional wisdom would say no, but… who knows.

bumbler
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:51 am: [report]

I probably just wouldn’t be friends with someone like him.

unbounded
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:55 am: [report]

Whoah, I would definitely NOT advise you to wait until you can say “I told you so” and then wash your hands of the whole thing.

Fact is, he HAS come to you for advice, and you’ve engaged in that conversation with him.  He’s your friend.  @lea322 is right - what he’s told you already is a basis for continuing the conversation.  If you only had your observations of his behavior and your theories on why he is the way he is, I would not be saying the same thing - but he’s already expressed doubts and the reasoning behind those doubts is not a more typical “I’m just scared of making such a big commitment.”

I think you should bring it up again, if only to clarify what it is he’s talking about. While ultimately it is his decision, I see nothing wrong with expressing your opinion to him (since he’s already opened the door) that getting married to someone that he loves now but isn’t sure he wants to be with for the rest of his life is most definitely not a good idea for anyone.

lea322
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:02 pm: [report]

On a side note, I don’t see the point of being friends with people who “stay out of my business”. Ultimately, I will make my own decisions, but I’m expecting my friend’s to give me their input, especially about stuff that matters.

SCRMOM
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:03 pm: [report]

@unbounded: She has given him her opinions, but he just hasn’t called off the wedding.  Since she has given her .02 already, she should leave it alone and let him make his own decision.

retro chic
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:04 pm: [report]

Yow. This is timely. A good friend of mine (since kindergarten!) is currently walking the plank towards marriage with her SO. I met him several times, hear about him thru her, and the only conclusion I can come to is: she’s going down the same road as her first marriage and with the same type guy. I think it would be a grave, insidious mistake. Her first marriage was so lacking in “couple contact” for so long, she’s grateful now for someone who is only a minor, and I mean minor, improvement but with the same stunted social/emotional profile. And she’s aware of that, but can’t help herself. I hope our talks allow her to see she can take a different path, expect more, and to not settle – again. I see The Talk coming, and know I’ll be wincing for awhile after. But I would expect the same of her, tables turned.

Kiki T
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:06 pm: [report]

sometimes you have to walk through the fire to learn your lesson

Jenbug
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:06 pm: [report]

You said she is from a religious background so it would probably be worse for her to have a divorce then end it now. If he is really so worried about it the dress give her $1200 and apologize for leading her on for so long. She deserves 100% percent from her husband and he does not sound like he will be able to give her that. Maybe you should talk to her instead, let her know that he wants out but he just doesn’t want to be the bad guy here. I know that I NEVER want to end up divorced.

_jsw_
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:08 pm: [report]

I ended up getting married because, among other things, I was in an area where I had no friends, my then-girlfriend had tons of friends and family who liked me, and I was, due to other relationships ending horrifically, not in a position to listen to my heart but was just lonely and afraid of getting hurt again. Had I had any friends and family around to not so much talk me out of it but simply to talk to me about it in a no-pressure environment and indicate that they’d support any decision I made. I’d very likely have not made what I knew, inside, was a mistake at the time.

So, were I in the position of being a friend to someone I didn’t think was ready for a given marriage, I’d at least talk to them and let them know they had my support no matter what they did and ask them how they were feeling about it.

QTKT
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:18 pm: [report]

I think you’ve made what you think clear. The next time he comes to you to vent/get advice, I would tell him he needs to seriously talk to his fiancee. Leaving her in the dark is going to hurt her, all of the other possibilities (divorce, adultery, etc.) will just add to the fact that he couldn’t be a man and tell her what he’s thinking/feeling.

QTKT
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:21 pm: [report]

Maybe they should try pre-marital counseling - I would think it would help them resolve this and any other issues.

retro chic
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:29 pm: [report]

@kiki:
sometimes you have to walk through the fire to learn your lesson

I would normally agree with that, but, to see my friend going back for grill marks on the other side is hard to watch.

HitOrMissJudy
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:34 pm: [report]

I told my friend the evil witch he was marrying was a lot like a cancerous tumor that he should cut out of his life. Instead, he went through with the wedding and now they’re having a kid. I still think he made a huge mistake, but we don’t talk much anymore—go figure!

However, I don’t regret opening my big yap one bit.

Kathls
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 12:57 pm: [report]

@Raugiel:  your actions fit in my girl code too.

My friends are my friends because they’re willing to watch my back and I will watch their’.  I did relay concern to a friend of 15 years about the express train she was taking to the alter, and it did blow up in my face.  BUT it was a good thing.  It made me realize that our friendship had died a long time ago, and that you do have to take into consideration in a situation like this whether or not you’re willing to lose the friendship over your concern.

I personally, would do it again in a heartbeat, not only because it cut off dead weight, but also because I knew I was being a good friend by saying something.  Of course take into consideration, I didn’t walk up to her and say ‘you are making the biggest mistake of your life.’  I just inquired about how long of an engagement they were planning and expressed my concern that they hadn’t known each other very long.

In the end I can sleep well knowing I was trying to be a good friend.  I would be extremely hurt if any of my friends didn’t tell me that they thought I was making such a huge mistake as to legally bind myself to someone that was completely wrong for me.  With regards to friends, I do what I think is right even if it’s awkward.  I could see taking offense if your great - great aunt Ethel was putting in her two cents, but your friends (not acquaintances) are supposed to look out for you, not MTOB, at least in my book.

That’s just one girl’s opinion on the situation.

Good luck

P.S.—if he didn’t want your opinion about the situation, he wouldn’t talk to you about it.  Doubting your wedding plans is extremely personal and terrifying, and he’s willing to talk to you about it.  If he is actually hungry for approval, that’s exactly what he’s looking for, but if you think giving your approval would be a big mistake, then don’t.

Karmatir
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 01:06 pm: [report]

I got married at 23 as well. I wish someone had stopped me. After several years of heartache, and an expensive divorce I found out the ex only married me so he wouldn’t hurt me or end up homeless (we were living together). His words. That hurt me more than stopping a wedding ever could. I want my early 20s back! At least I’m only 28, divorced 3 years and have plenty of time yo do it for all the right reasons with someone.

tabby
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 01:35 pm: [report]

You are obviously one of his close friends and I think you have an obligation to point out the obvious to him. Just flat out tell him that his behavior indicates that he does not want to get married. Tell him that he has the right to break off an engagement, no matter how much has already been spent (what? does he think divorces are cheaper?), and that his fiancee would much rather know sooner rather than later that he doesn’t really intend to marry her. Tell him it is time to “man up” about what he really thinks and feels about the situation. Then you have to let it go. If he goes through with it, you have to go to the wedding and smile and sincerely wish them the best. If he has marriage problems later, then you just listen and refrain from reminding him that you told him so. If they are happily married for the next fifty years, then you can atone for doubting it by hosting their golden wedding anniversary.

nicole0X
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 02:23 pm: [report]

Your friend will blame you for “what could’ve been” if you talk her out of it. Do what I did: Express your concern but let her make her own decision. Then when she gets divorced 2 years later, you can say “I told you so!” Seriously, though.. if your friend is really planning on getting married, you have every responsibility to tell them exactly how you feel. But you have no right to talk them out of it. The ultimate decision lies with them.

DancingGeek
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 03:46 pm: [report]

@ JamieLee- OMG same here! people came out of the woodwork, even family, telling me how much they disliked him, would have been nice to know 22 year ago.

You know why divorce is so expensive? It’s worth it.

Sad situation, most people in that situation wouldn’t really listen to the opionion of others if they truly believe they are in love. Hind sight is 20/20.

AgentBeryllium
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 04:19 pm: [report]

@Jessica

If I were you and one of my guy friends pulling this crap on his fiancee/girlfriend. I would tell him grow a pair of balls and be honest with her. If she’s not the right fit it’s only going to get worse. Plus in the end, it’s going to hurt much worse if they married, then he said it isn’t working out. As apposed to being up front.

I think the reason why he came to you and spoke about this is because he really needs an opinion. Guys normally won’t saying anything unless need be.

Knitter79
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 05:30 pm: [report]

Another side of this…it’s possible that the fiance doesn’t really want to marry him but she is because of the pressure from her family.  Encourage them to talk to each other about this.  If they can’t be honest with each other they shouldn’t be getting married.  Doesn’t sound like telling him not to marry her is working.  Try another route.

Jessica Wakeman
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 05:38 pm: [report]

My prediction on what’s going to happen with my friend and his fiancée? He’s going to wait for HER to end the relationship, whether it’s before the wedding when she notices just how cold his feet or, or several years from now after they’ve tried to make it worth. It is this guy’s M.O. to do wait for them to dump him regardless of how messed up their relationship is, so at least he can say, “Well, I tried to make it work, I didn’t end it —— she did.” I would bet money on it that that’s what will happen here.

Laurel
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 06:53 pm: [report]

@Jessica, that given, then I’d talk to his fiancee. Not #&@$% stirring, just the facts of what he’s told you. Or actually, tell him you’re going to tell her if he won’t. Do you think that would work? She needs to know this BEFORE marrying him.

Lexington
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 09:41 pm: [report]

I wish I’d spoken up sooner to one of my friends- when she told me she was engaged to this guy she’d known a month, I asked her if she’d really thought it through, reminded her that her parents are miserable together, and tried to remind her she still had time. Since I didn’t know the guy at the time, I wasn’t about to say anything more.

I was gearing up to tell her that she was making a mistake when she called to tell me they’d eloped cause she was pregnant, and now I’m too mad to even speak to her. Tell your friend!

bjoontheupside
wrote on October 7 2009 @ 11:08 pm: [report]

I definitely don’t think there’s anything you can do about this situation. I had a friend a while back that was, and still is, engaged to be married. The problem? There are many problems with their relationship from an outsider’s perspective. One big red flag is that they’ve been engaged now for almost nine years now. Every time they’ve discussed setting a date or putting away money for the wedding it just never stuck for either or them, yet they both claimed to WANT to get married. I knew this couple for several years and watched in horror on several occasions how dysfunctional their relationship was. Since I was good friends with one of them, I also had the misfortune of finding out even more about their relationship, like how she had cheated on him with more than one guy and how she confessed that she wasn’t that into her fiance for several months while they dated, yet said yes anyways when he proposed. It’s really sad because her fiance is a pretty decent guy and has chosen to stay with her even after finding out about one affair, (but not the other-she refused to him). Ultimately though, it was never my place to try to intervene into their lives. All I could do was sit and listen and try to give advice without overstepping my bounds.

og217
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 02:27 am: [report]

People seem to think that there is an option of “speaking up” and thus stopping the wedding.  Are you all crazy?  What engaged woman is going to listen?  Here’s whats going to happen - she will become even more determined to get married to prove you wrong, and become convinced that you are trying to break her and her man up because you want him for yourself.  All you can accomplish is that she’ll tell him that he cannot be friends with you any more.  And as the fiance / wife of a fairly weak-minded guy, she’ll win, and frankly she will be right.

tkisfabulous
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:26 am: [report]

I think giving your adviced, is a good idea, rather he asked for it or not.  Sometimes that is what being a good friend is all about.  Doing what’s right, even if it’s hard.  Im not suggesting you badger him to leave her.  Simply offer your advice.. as advice, not suggestion, and tell him you will support him regardless of his choice.  Then leave the subject alone unless he seeks more advice from you.  But if he is truly a good friend, you can’t ignore such an important subject.  While it may suck a the time, a lost deposit on a reception location is cheaper than a divorce on any day.

LostInStars
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 12:28 pm: [report]

I think the best thing you can do is tell him how you feel, but you can’t drive it into his skull. I’ve had this situation before. I tried to tell him what he really already knew deep down, but he told her I was trying to call off their big thing, blah blah blah… she hates me, he’s not allowed to talk to me anymore, and they’re both miserable.

Elena
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 01:52 pm: [report]

@Jessica - maybe there’s a solution here that will keep you from talking someone out of marriage but also allow your friend and his fiancé to figure out if a walk down the aisle is really in their best interests right now.

why don’t you recommend that your friend and his fiancé go to pre-maritals counseling? you don’t have to make a big deal out of it. just maybe tell him that if he’s having second thoughts, maybe he and his fiancé should talk them out with someone who’s professionally equipped to deal.

if either of them is religious, his/her/their place(s) of worship can be a good place to ask about pre-marital counseling. if not, they should look for a licensed counselor/therapist with experience in this area. the idea with pre-marital counseling is to help the future spouses hash-out issues that might make trouble for them in their marriage (for example, a desire to pursue other sexual relationships) and hopefully express themselves honestly and resolve the issues. but if the issues aren’t resolvable, well, that’s good to figure out BEFORE the wedding, like you said in your article.

elansdale
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:22 pm: [report]

I think that often we think that our friends are simply clueless in their pursuit to make mistakes. We assume that we can add facts that would change their minds. But, in my life, I have made many mistakes knowing they were bad ones, but the nagging thought of ...Well, I will be the exception…my own stupidity won out despite people trying to talk me out of things. I suffered the consequences you can be sure. And know this; his fiance is not innocent in all this. She knows he is flakey and doesn’t want to go through with the wedding, but she is pushing for it anyways. You can confront him all you want, but I would bet my money he already knows everything you are going to say because he has said it to himself and will do it anyways. And they only have themselves to blame.

Asta
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 03:38 pm: [report]

When my friends tell me those kinds of things I state things as how as a girl I would rather be broke up with than pity-married. Also, have you just said “A real man would walk away and have that conversation than act like a wimp marrying someone he doesn’t want to commit to?” I have also said something similar to a habitual cheater friend of mine- but then people only tell me these kinds of things when they want to be yelled at- cause i’m pretty upfront about such things.

Gingee
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 04:05 pm: [report]

Stay out of it.  It is none of your business.

thickasawhaleomelette
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 08:56 pm: [report]

It sounds like he really is asking you “Should I break this off?” I don’t think it’s up to you to talk him out of getting married; it us up to you to be honest with him that you think he’s making a mistake based on what he’s told you, and to commit to supporting him no matter what he decides.

To me, one of the worst feelings is after a relationship goes sour and friends chime in that they’re glad you aren’t with that person anymore, or that they could that it was going to end. Sometimes they say it to be supportive, but it makes me feel like I’ve been lied to. Then, I’m at the end of a relationship and feel like my friends don’t tell me the truth: i.e., doubly awful.

dizzy
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 10:45 pm: [report]

“$1,200 on a gown!” What a dumbass. A divorce costs so much more. Plus they’ll be that much older when they’re back on the market.

You can’t protect him from his own stupidity. I think you’ve been doing the right thing by making noises, but it sounds like it is all fruitless.

draymond
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 11:26 pm: [report]

Normally I would say no to talking a friend out of getting married.  But something is going on here.

Why is he telling you about wanting to put it off further?  Why is he telling you about wanting to explore other women?  Why is he foisting off such a lame excuse as she has spent so much on the dress (and not doubt a lot of other things)?  The reason is….he is asking you to talk him out of it.

You’re right, don’t butt into his business, but it sounds like he is instead asking for advice.  If that is so, then as a friend you have to give your best advice.

snap
wrote on October 9 2009 @ 07:40 am: [report]

this guy is desperately reaching out to you.  there is no butting-in here; he needs advice and guidance, and he has turned to you.  by all means, help him explore his feelings.  the result may be a broken engagement and a devastated woman, but i’m sure she’d rather not get married than suffer through a rapidly deteriorating marriage.

majicksand
wrote on October 9 2009 @ 08:34 am: [report]

He’s going to marry her unless she calls it off.  It doesn’t matter what you say to him.  He’s secretly hoping you’ll be bold enough to talk her out of it for him.  If you’re close enough to her to feel comfortable with that, tell her what he has said.  Otherwise, leave it to her friends to open her eyes.

He’s weak-willed enough to marry the wrong girl so he won’t look like the bad guy.  If she’s weak-willed enough to marry the wrong guy because of family pressure, they will most likely learn a tough lesson together.

Let’s just hope they don’t have kids before they figure it out.

audrey45
wrote on October 11 2009 @ 09:25 am: [report]

This is a tricky one - especially because most people in this situation are just going to do what they want despite any advice from their friends or family. Plus, you don’t want to try to “break up” your friend’s impending nuptials, simply because if he does end up marrying her, you will always be that friend who tried to break up their wedding. Awk-ward. I’m not against giving him advice, but maybe you could just try to get him thinking about what he really wants and what would be best for both him and his fiancee (after all, nobody wants to be the bad guy, but after all, this is just like taking off a band aid - i feel like realizing that your husband didn’t want to marry you after a few years is going to hurt a lot more than taking care of this situation early on). Figuring out what you want is really tough, and he should be thinking through all of his options before he decides to commit his life to one person; However, he is the one who needs to make the ultimate decision, whether it is a mistake or not.

og217
wrote on October 11 2009 @ 01:02 pm: [report]

If you simply must blathe rabout your opinion, I’d try blathering at the guy though.  He is your friend, talk to him.  To his fiance, you are just some dubious female and since she imagines that her guy is THE catch, she will not listen to anyone who tries to dissuade her.  at the end of the day, you want to be around for your friend to call when he divorces, so don’t burn bridges and make it impossible to come to you and admit you were right.

OKSUNI
wrote on October 13 2009 @ 07:39 am: [report]

I would tell him to go ahead and get married if that what he wants to do….but he would be a TOTAL IDIOT to have kids with her anytime soon. REPEAT: DO NOT have children until you have been married for 5 years at least and have come to grips with being married..might be just cold feet. Screw her parents—-he needs to tell her that their married life WILL NOT be dictated by their values..WILL NOT BE..because kids will be the next thing that they will put the pressure on about, then probably for her to stop working….Im telling you..WAIT TO HAVE KIDS!!!!!

Ariandre
wrote on October 15 2009 @ 12:03 am: [report]

Speaking from personal experience; it takes a true friend to tell you the truth.  I think you should tell him you feel he is making a mistake, and the best thing you can do is list out all the reasons why.  If your friend is anything like me he is already thinking of those reasons as well but just needs a nudge from someone to really face those issues head on.
As to his fiance already buying the wedding dress and everything…I was the bride that had already bought the wedding dress and believe you me I prefer having an “almost” dress in the closet than an ex husband.

sandylucky
wrote on October 21 2009 @ 05:40 pm: [report]

I regret NOT telling my friend that she was making a mistake getting married.  For nine years and three kids, I heard nothing positive about her spouse, and have only ONCE in that time heard that she actually thinks she loves him (“well, of course I love him but”).  All I heard before she got married was “my biological clock is running out” and “I’m so happy to have someone to date”.  Even when she was engaged, it was an invitation to the engagement party, not “I’m so happy he asked me!” or “I’m so in love!”.

I feel even more sorry for him, it’s no wonder now they are living apart during the week “because of finances he needed a job three hours away” and the only downside is that he can’t help shuttle the kids around?  I can see where this is going, but now with kids involved, I’m staying out of it.  Would I have said something honest before she got married, maybe both her and her husband would be in a happier place today, separately.