How Do You Define Cheating?

bumbler
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 08:17 am: [report]

Once people are in a mutually agreed on committed relationship a good rule of thumb for inappropriate behavior is if you wouldn’t do it in front of me (excepting ridiculous exceptions) it’s probably not respectful.  That’s how my husband and I operate.  I don’t go out and flirt with random guys, he doesn’t have girls sit on his lap.  Things that may not be cut and dry cheating but are a breach of trust in our relationship.  Everyone’s boundaries are different so I don’t understand why you wouldn’t just have a long talk with your partner about what you see as disrespectful or cheating and let that work for your relationship.

saramarie
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 08:30 am: [report]

I think that any sexual interaction or encounter you have with someone that you know your partner would feel uncomfortable/upset about or you wouldn’t want them to know about is cheating in my book. The key component to this definition is taking your partner’s feelings into consideration when making your decisions, i.e. “would John be upset if I sat on this guys lap, or would he find it harmless?”. It could even be something as small as flirting…if you wouldn’t feel comfortable flirting with that person in front of your partner or telling them about it, it’s probably wrong.

I’d like to think this would apply for all different kinds of relationships since every relationship is different and some may be more open than others. For example, one couple may agree that flirting or even having sex with others only enhances their relationship with one another, while another couple feels that flirting of any kind while in a relationship is out of the question.

tabby
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 08:58 am: [report]

Ah, but when your boyfriend used to be in a triad relationship (with two girlfriends who were also each other’s girlfriends), you actually have to spell out all of the relationship rules for all possible situations. For example, our relationship allows for random harmless flirting as we are both big flirts, and also for random drunken making out at parties (but only making out, second base and beyond are against our rules.) I think it is actually really helpful to have all the possible situations spelled out in advance. It assures that when the other person is not around, no one will have to worry about trust getting broken. Oh, and did I mention the very obvious rule of no making out with ex-lovers? See? lots of explicit rules can be helpful.

MichelleS1017
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 09:01 am: [report]

agree w/ bumbler.. any inappropriate behavior that would not be done in front of me. i would not do anything that i would not want my SO to do behind my back.
and, inappropriate behavior is really not gray, as some play dumb that it is

ChoJinn
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 09:08 am: [report]

Agreed.  What constitutes cheating is what the person being cheated on finds offensive; totally a subjective standard.  Some hyper insecure friends, both male and female, go apesh*t if their significant other so much as smiles at someone of the opposite.  Other, less maladjusted and more confident friends let theirs behave themselves.  There are obvious boundaries, to be sure.  Even for those “open” couples who let each other have sex with whomever, I’d argue they hide their complete lack of self-esteem behind an illusory notion of sexual enlightenment.

No reasonable guy would consider his girlfriend sitting on another guy’s lap cheating per se (though highly offensive, and deserving of a push down the stair….I mean, a friendly chat), just as no reasonable woman should consider a guy being animatedly friendly with another girl cheating.  For me, kissing and anything past that = cheating.

Miss M
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 09:09 am: [report]

This reminds me of a good ‘ol Sex and the City quote: “a cheating curve. That someone’s definition of what constitutes cheating is in direct proportion to how much they themselves want to cheat.”

claviviera
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 09:11 am: [report]

I had to register to be able to leave this comment. This hits home, people!
True story: I started dating a guy last summer - long distance - so, while we were planning a visit, things progressed and lead to very steamy phone and skype conversations. Went on for a while and then I discovered he was married!! GASP. And guess what - he NEVER thought he was cheating!!
I guess the joke was on me, but still…..
HOW could he justify that?! He kept saying that just because it wasn’t really sex, it wasn’t really cheating.
BUT then we aren’t even talking about all the hours on the phone just talking (Isn’t that an EMOTIONAL AFFAIR!?!)
Don’t ask me where the wife was… she must be clueless or ignorant… and he is playing a joke on her too!!

I guess I’d rather have my partner drunk in a bar pick up a one night stand, before my partner develops an emotional affair. Those are so much more dangerous.

becktasm
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 11:39 am: [report]

I have a rather strict definition of cheating. My man, of course, may not sleep with another woman, but he also may not kiss them, grope them, or touch them in any other sexual way.  Also: No lap dances. That’s sexual touching, and is forbidden. Luckily, my boyfriend loves me oodles and agrees wholeheartedly with these restrictions, since he knows not agreeing with them would mean losing me and that’s not a risk he’s willing to take.

A couple weeks ago a friend of my boyfriend’s asked him to go to a strip club and his response was, “Why in the world would I pay to see some stranger naked when I could go home and get that and more from my girlfriend, for free?” Now that’s the kind of attitude all men should have. I’m a lucky girl.

Lynn
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 11:42 am: [report]

I think a breach of trust and cheating are similar, but aren’t always the same thing. For example, if my BF was out and was sexually flirting with a girl, and had her on his lap, I would be livid. But I don’t consider it technically *cheating* until he kisses her (or more). I wouldn’t be HAPPY if he was grinding with someone at a bar, and it definitely wouldn’t bode well for our relationship, and it would be scummy of him….but he wouldn’t be cheating.

But I do think that no one can be cheated on *unless* there has actually been a “we are in an exclusive relationship” talk. I’ve gotten in “trouble” before when a guy just *assumed* he was my boyfriend, without ever actually running that past me, and then got upset when he found out I went out with someone else.

bogart4017
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 11:48 am: [report]

No one needs a dictionary to define what cheating is. If you’re in a relationship you know what it is. And no man is as clueless as he acts—women don’t need to define cheating for us. Some of us just like to be “put on a leash” ok? If its something that she would smack you upside your head for even thinking it, its cheating. Don’t do it. If its something that she’s set your clothes on fire and throw you outdoors for, its cheating. Dont do it.

juliePS
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 01:29 pm: [report]

this may seem oversimplified, but cheating in a relationship is like cheating at Monopoly—you establish the rules when you start the game, and if you break the rules, you’re cheating. I think that’s the problem a lot of people run into, they don’t ever establish the rules! They assume that whoever they’re with ‘knows’ that a certain behavior is off-limits, and the other party either (a) doesn’t think of it in the same way, and thus inadvertently ‘cheats’ or (b) uses the wiggle room brought on by the lack of clear boundaries to get away with whatever they want. Sure, it’s awkward as hell to sit down with your significant other and go “okay, if one of us gets drunk and makes out with somebody else, that’s fine, but if clothes come off, that’s cheating,” but it definitely makes things easier in the long haul. (Sorry, I have some background in poly relationships, where we discuss EVERYTHING because when you’re already banging people who are not your partner, then it’s *really* important to have boundaries because it ain’t a free-for-all.)

elpee
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 01:56 pm: [report]

i have an important question for everyone. i need help. what if two people have been married for long time, and the man has several very very close female “friend"ships. VERY close. nobody’s been caught having sex, but they go out until late, and spend time away from the man’s wife. flirty e-mails and texts all the time. the man does not let his wife meet these women. he knows this bothers her and he doesn’t care. he refuses to go to marriage counseling, although she goes alone because she is distraught about all of this. the man lies often about who he is talk to and what he has done. what should the woman do? does this constitute a divorce, in your opinion? much appreciated.

bumbler
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 02:00 pm: [report]

@elpee It is not something I would tolerate.  I would divorce my husband if he acted like that but what I think isn’t important.  What matter is that the woman in the relationship takes a long hard look at what she wants and what she is willing to put up with.  There is no right answer because everyone has different boundaries.  She should do whatever it takes to respect herself.

sklut
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 06:52 pm: [report]

Wow Iggie… that’s insightful.

Buhri
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 07:31 pm: [report]

@elpee, sounds like a mistress to me. The fact that he won’t let you mean her seals the deal, this is one of the very few times I’d say an ultimatum is necessary. It’s you or her and if he chooses her, you’re much much better off.

_jsw_
wrote on July 14 2009 @ 07:54 pm: [report]

@elpee: “he knows this bothers her and he doesn’t care.” That says it all to me. He’s consistently out with other women, they are providing him with entertainment of at least some sort, he knows it hurts you, and he doesn’t care. He does not appear to respect you or to treat you as one would expect a spouse to be treated. If you stay, stay because it’s best for you to stay. Clearly, it’s good for him. He has all he wants. Make sure it’s good for you, or leave - just my opinion.

majicksand
wrote on July 15 2009 @ 10:20 am: [report]

@elpee:  If the wife is not “allowed” to meet her husband’s female friends, there is a serious problem.  Not wanting his wife around for “guys night out” is one thing, but excluding her from his socializing—especially with other women is a texas sized red flag.

As far as general cheating, anything beyond casual flirting among friends is off-limits.  We all know the difference between playful fun and flirting with intent. 

My husband and I are on a pool team together at a go-go bar.  I’m relatively new, but he’s been on the same team for 20 years.  He knows everyone.  Attractive, half-naked, 20-something women walk up and give him a hug every week.  I’m not bothered in the least.  Occasionally he will walk up to the runway and drop a few dollars for a friend then walk away.  I even throw money occasionally for a girl who is really good.  That’s no big deal.  On the other hand, if I ever caught him sitting at the runway staring at some girl’s… whatever, I’d snatch him up by his hair and mop the floor with him.

Sexual contact of any form is totally off-limits.  That includes verbal and visual contact.  I agree with claviviera that emotional affairs can be at least as devastating as physical ones.  He’s either mine or he’s not.  There is no gray area.

northernbird
wrote on July 17 2009 @ 04:29 pm: [report]

Here’s a debate I had with the last man I was involved with and with the current man I’m involved with:  If a man is at the store say and sees a nice-looking woman and he admires her, tries to catch her eye, and smiles at her if she responds to his gaze, is that cheating?  My former BF and current BF both engage in this behavior and it hurts me.  My relationship with the former BF ended with his flagrant cheating.  My current BF insists the eye-catch game is not harmful, even tho it frequently leads to conversations with women he plays the game with, because the game doesn’t result in a date, kissing, or sex.  I still feel he’s cheating because to me it seems like he’s testing the waters to see if both he and she hit it off. What do you all think?  My former BF was handsome but the guy I’m with now is extremely, extremely good-looking.  I’m talking absolutely gorgeous.
My internal question is “why does he do it”?  I don’t.  If I played that game I’d be asked out and I don’t want to go there.

_jsw_
wrote on July 17 2009 @ 04:33 pm: [report]

@northernbird: I don’t think his behavior is cheating. I do, however, think it’s setting up a possible cheating situation, and it’s a sign that he’s either insecure or an incurable womanizer or both. A man who’s happy with you and with himself can be friendly with others, but he doesn’t need to play those games.

northernbird
wrote on July 17 2009 @ 06:07 pm: [report]

I used to be a flirt and it got me into trouble.  With my last BF, I didn’t care how friendly he was with other women until his behavior with them got out of hand, like a kiss on the mouth and holding hands in front of me and everyone else.  He was acting this way with a married woman and her husband told her to knock it off.  I was pretty upset too.  After that I noticed more, and more, and then the secret email account, etc until I realized he was meeting women out of town.  Now I’m very jealous.  Another woman told me that too, that she wasn’t jealous until her husband left her for another woman and now she’s paranoid with every man she dates.  So I guess it’s a sensitivity thing.  I don’t mean to punish my current BF, but he sure plays on his good looks.  But, two can play that game and we’ll see where it leads.  Seems like an immature reaction, but I feel I need to do something.

_jsw_
wrote on July 17 2009 @ 06:13 pm: [report]

@northernbird: Then the end has already begun. Given his behavior, I suppose it was inevitable. I’m sorry.

elpee
wrote on July 19 2009 @ 06:16 am: [report]

Thanks for all the help, everybody. One more question to add to that: do you think you could ever live with a husband who is cheating—even if it’s just emotional cheating? If the man refuses to change, but the two get along (no fighting, good friends), what should the woman do if she thinks to herself, “maybe I can live with this. I love my life, my husband provides for me, and I’ll just keep on being independent and living well.”

No relationship is perfect. It is so easy for girls to sit on the sidelines when their friends complain about their boyfriends and say, “screw him, leave his ass!” I think girls sometimes actually like to do that. But in the end, you’re the one who loves him, has fun with him, and has to live with your decision. I’m not saying anyone is doing that here, but it’s something to think about.

@northernbird, that situation with your ex sounds very scarring. it can’t hurt to pay very—like VERY close attention to your current bf if you are suspicious of anything. i think you have that right. read e-mails, know where he is, know who his friends are. i read on another message board once that every man has cheated on his significant other, and if he hasn’t, he is ugly. that is obviously ridiculous, but ... why do men cheat more than women, I mean, don’t they? Is it because men’s brains are still programmed to spread the seed and women are ingrained to have one baby and find one person to stay with her and care for it? Does it go back to the cavemen?

I am the last one that should be sharing thoughts about this, I’m the one who needs help. But (I know this may sound unbelievable), I am actually asking on behalf of a friend—my best friend, my mother.

northernbird
wrote on July 19 2009 @ 02:58 pm: [report]

I’m finding that despite other peoples’ well-meaning advice and despite the fact that when I see my SO try to get another woman’s attention and then play the “look at me aren’t I cute game,” saying you are going to ditch him is much easier said than done.  I’m finding my SO will behave for a while after he gets in trouble, but then falls back to the flirting default eventually.  If I would have seen this behavior in the beginning, I know I would have been too scared to get involved any further and I would have dated someone else as I had plenty of options.  I liked him the best. we get along great, he assured me from the get-go that he would never cheat on me, and I didn’t see this behavior in the beginning.  We were very much in love then.  Head over heels.  He still swears he has never cheated, but his behavior around pretty women disturbs me and hurts. I’ve broken up with him 3 times now and each time miss him so much that when he calls, I cave.  His relatives and friends assure me he’s a good man and I know he’s a good provider and would do anything for me.  He loves me very much, and this is really the only problem we have aside from the minor irritations that are part of a normal relationship, so what it comes down to is a choice to live with this behavior for the rest of our lives together or get up the courage to break off with him and stick to it.  I’ve had my say and there’s nothing else I can do. Who’s to say too that the next man won’t behave the same way after I’m emotionally in too deep to get out without big heartache?

My advice is to talk to the man as maybe he’s not aware of what he’s doing and how much it hurts (I have known women who have left husbands over this behavior alone even knowing they have never cheated on them, so it’s not like we’re overreacting).  If he continues the behavior, then it’s time to make the choice.  A lot of men see nothing wrong with this behavior and yes, some men are harem animals.  I know a few men who coincidentally were raised Mormon and seem to have the hots for every good-looking chick they see. They practically drool.  I wonder if they would be surprised to find most women find this behavior immature, disgusting, and predatory.  If we behaved that way we’d be called sluts, but some men too could be labeled at lechers, so take your pick.

northernbird
wrote on July 19 2009 @ 03:12 pm: [report]

Elpee, I just re-read your post. The behavior you describe is almost exactly the way my ex behaved.  I found out after we split that some of his out of town trips involved prostitutes.  Friends my ass. If this man makes a lot of money you can bet there is some illicit sex going on.  If he’s good looking too then you KNOW what’s happening.  Most men cannot resist women who come on to them and if you combine good looks and money the opportunities are way, way too many to pass all of them up.  Based on my experience this man is having way too much fun. He’s looking because he’s looking.

By the way, he probably DOES still love his wife.  It would never occur to him that she has figured anything out.  Most men want their cake and to eat it too.  Even when faced with overwhelming evidence, they’ll deny they cheated.  I discovered phone calls to and from women on a cell phone bill he forgot to burn, and I know he had a secret email account at work that he used to set up liaisons.  He denied all that.  Then I was told he was dating a woman he told me he’d never be interested in if we weren’t together. Lies, lies, lies.  He’s still lying.  None of his friends will talk to me now because of the lies he told them about ME. The situation you describe sounds so familiar to me.

wonderfultonight
wrote on July 20 2009 @ 12:45 am: [report]

Nothernbird: You say you have broken up with him 3 times already, yet he still carries on this behavior, knowing how much it hurts you. Your ex behaved like this and it led to flagrant cheating. Think hard about this BF’s continued behavior - do you really want to put up with it “for the rest of your lives?” He does this because he can. Terrific looking people of both sexes are constantly getting hit on and it’s easy to stray when the right temptation presents itself.

Oh, gosh, this has warning flags all over it. Your bf probably does *love* you, but he allows himself something “extra” despite the sadness it causes you. This is troubling, to say the least, since it is more important to him to continue this behavior than to put you and your love for him first. I would guess that it will get worse, not better if he knows you have made the choice to put up with it. Look down the road a bit to the day you might get married and have a family. He isn’t going to change for the better and it will be much harder to end it then. Sadly, a broken heart now is still better than a lifetime of misery and broken promises. Re-read your post to Elpee -you were right on the money and could that situation so clearly; it is so much harder to see the one so close to you now, which seems to exactly mirror your ex.

I am so sorry you are going through this and I hope you find the right answer for YOU. Be true to yourself always.

realbigal
wrote on July 25 2009 @ 03:19 am: [report]

Good evening
I am engaged male, and out of town Monday thru Friday, my fiancee, on occasion has gone to a movie with a male coworker who I know and consider a good friend. On another occasion she and an older coworker by about 15 years,called in sick one week day and went down to the beach for the day. She claims she just needed company, and there was nothing to it. I feel there was a breach of trust here especially if there was any physical contact, even just holding hands. In my mind holding hands is a sign of affection, protection, and give comfort,and sends the message we are out of the market. I would appreciate any of your comments.  Thanks Al

majicksand
wrote on July 25 2009 @ 08:13 am: [report]

@realbigal: Does she always choose male friends for her outings, or are these isolated?  Did she tell you before, as soon after as possible, only when you might find out on your own, or did you find out and confront her?  Have you discussed your feelings with her? (as opposed to accepting what she said then later deciding it bothers you without telling her)

realbigal
wrote on July 25 2009 @ 09:11 am: [report]

Majicksand

Thank you for your response. As far as friend selection, mostly male, she told me about movie incedent in a letter that I received the day, of the outing, she does not consider it a date, just going out with a friend. She knows how I feel about it. She has a habit of telling people including me what she thinks I want to hear. Rather then making waves it is easier to tell a few half truths, or soft lies.

Thank Al

majicksand
wrote on July 25 2009 @ 10:31 am: [report]

Al

Without knowing anything about your fiancee, I can only tell you how I think.  Hopefully, you’ll get feedback from other women as well, so you can compare.

I have lots of male friends, many I have known since highschool.  My husband knows about all of them and has met any with whom I have had personal contact. (some are out-of-state)  I told him from the beginning that I do not tolerate jealousy in my relationships.  If he could not handle his girlfriend/wife having male friends, we didn’t need to be together.

That being said, I am very forthcoming with details.  No conversation is a secret.  I respect my husband’s feelings enough to ensure he doesn’t feel like a third wheel in MY life.  It’s OUR life.

Thankfully, my husband is very laid back and confident in the strength of our marriage.  When a friend came into town to visit his parents, we arranged to have lunch.  My husband and I can’t both leave the office, so my friend and I went alone.  My friend came to my office, I introduced him to my husband, and we left.  After about 5 hours, my husband called to check on me.  I was still sitting at the table in the restaurant chatting.  It was another hour before I finally came back.  The restaurant is about 1 mile from the office.

When we walked in, my husband smiled, greeted my friend and asked if we had fun.  The two of them actually shared a joke at my expense.  Something about getting out alive once you let me start talking… I wonder what they meant by that? lol

Anyway, if your girlfriend is generally trustworthy, you need to relax.  You said you are gone a lot with work.  She needs friends to keep her company when she can’t be with you.  If her behavior is truly suspicious, you may have a larger issue.  For that matter, it may come down to different philosophies regarding the “rules” of a relationship and differing comfort levels.  All you can really do is talk to her and decide whether or not the two of you are compatible in your beliefs.

I hope this helps.

realbigal
wrote on July 26 2009 @ 08:51 am: [report]

I read your last response a few times, and you say a lot that I can relate to, all my life I have been a stickler for truth, my feeling is that words without truth is only noise, a that has been across the board, not just with my life partner. Two things that have been important for us, and not always easy are share each others feeling,  and emotions, and try to stay away from our communication to get to generic. I will keep in touch and thank you for your effort.
Al

BeachGirl
wrote on August 9 2009 @ 02:37 pm: [report]

For me this all hits really close to home. My DH and I have been married for 12 years, this past Christmas I accidentally found out he had been talking with and sending love letters (and god knows what else) to his ex wife. His reason? I wasn’t giving him enough “attention”. So it was all my fault??
We are still together trying to move past it and it is very difficult to say least. I still get a knot in my stomach when his phone rings or he gets a text. CHEATING IS CHEATING! Whether it’s physical or emotional, it still wreaks havoc in your life and has long lasting effects.

bigtone128
wrote on October 10 2009 @ 03:48 pm: [report]

okay here is something that happened to me recently - had a male friend stay with us who was going through a hard time - then in June my wife asks me for a separation agreement - i was shocked. I got into her emails and found that she forwarded an email on to him about women are like apples and all one has to do is go for the fruit high on the tree and do not settle for low hanging fruit.  then she arranged a birthday party for him and gave him a graduation gift at the same time fathers day was and yet she had no money for my fathers day gift. then when i left with the kids AND my friend she said how she felt so betrayed by my friend leaving.  then i later found out when she was with him one time she told her friend she was separated but living together.  then my friend got into a relationship and she ran the girl down.  now she wants to get back together but after months of saying what a horrible husband i was - why is she saying i am such a good guy now - i cannot trust her anymore…..then i found her putting posts on another friend of mine’s photos.  she says she did not feel any emotions for my friends but i do not believe her.

northernbird
wrote on October 11 2009 @ 03:18 pm: [report]

She doesn’t know what to do.  She does like you and probably loves you and she knows what she feels is wrong, but she probably feels strong attraction for him and maybe something happened, maybe not.

I once refused a friend’s request to come live with me for a while because she and her BF weren’t getting along.  I was afraid my BF would have an affair with her.  Instead he had an affair with someone else.  I tried to hang on to him, but it didn’t work, he was emotionally ready to move on. He was bored with me.

I’m not saying that’s what is happening in your situation, but I can tell you she’s confused and doesn’t know what she wants.  She does want to be faithful and be there for the kids, to be a family unit, but she probably wants to pursue something else too.  If you and her were not getting along when your friend moved in, that would explain a lot too.

I’ll tell you one thing, if you love her and want to keep her, go to counseling now and don’t put it off.  It would worth the investment if you can afford it at all.  At least if things still fall apart, you can tell yourself and your kids that you tried.  I would also make it clear that you will not put up with any lies. No relationship can make it if lies are the hidden ghosts behind everything.

Also, if you’re a good guy, a good woman will find you so don’t worry too much about what would happen after you get over all this, if it doesn’t work out despite your best efforts.  I’d love to be in an entirely faithful relationship with a good guy and I love kids.

northernbird
wrote on October 11 2009 @ 04:29 pm: [report]

By the way, I don’t mean to minimize what you’re going through.  It hurts like hell and it’s very confusing.  I think I would rather die than go through another broken heart, and that’s why I cannot completely let my guard down.  I think I will remain defensive for the rest of my life and will never completely give my heart away again.

In a perfect world you can love, cherish, and trust your chosen mate, but it’s sure not a perfect world.

bigtone128
wrote on October 12 2009 @ 02:17 am: [report]

thanks Northernbird.

well, i know nothing happened physically but not due to her - but due to my friend. I think she was waiting for him to make the first move.  she now wants back in my life and brags what a good guy i am but…..how come i was a slug before—-now that nothing’s changed - I am such a good guy. confusing…...hhmmm. then i found out through my friend that when i took her on a trip and she told me how beautiful it was as soon as she got back she told him it was a “disaster”.  so how do i trust what she says anymore?  I listen to every word she says and i mistrust her.  Once I questioned her on the relationship with my friend and she said “you did not have to worry about John, he made it clear that the door was closed”. hhmmm how would she know that??? does this mean she looking for an open door?  then my friend tells me she went to him and said to him - I see how my husband is good for you - he gets you out of yourself. well, why is she so concerned about him and how good i am for him?? why would she not come to me and tell me that?? tell me i am good for him? and why be concerned about his welfare and not my own?  I am just suspicious now of everything she says or does…..

onewriter
wrote on November 4 2009 @ 12:55 am: [report]

This can be hard.  If person #1 in relationship A has the emotional attachment, but goes out with another person, the other half of relationship A wouldn’t necessarily care, but because of how person #1 feels, it could be considered cheating.  On the other hand, if both people in relationship A are committed openly to one another, anything beyond casual looking is uncouth.  Either you’re both in the relationship, or you’re not.

MrB.
wrote on November 4 2009 @ 06:30 am: [report]

Now, I’ve got a bit of a different outlook on all this. My wife and I have had what we call an open relationship since we got together almost eight years ago. For us, cheating is any kind of intimate contact with anyone else only if the other partner is either not aware or not in approval. If she or I have feelings, lust, crushes, etc. for someone, we simply talk things over. As long as we’re both open and honest about everything, there’s no reason for trust or jealousy. The “side” person just has to understand that my wife and I are committed and happy together, and that we will not tolerate anyone trying to break us up. In many cases the other person is included in our group of friends and made to feel welcome rather than feeling like an outsider. In the rare instance where one of us might feel a tinge of the green-eyed-monster, we talk things over with each other, and often with the other person as well, until everyone feels comfortable. If a comfort level can’t be reached with everyone then, the other relationship is dissolved. This has only ever happened once, though, and most of our former lovers remain friends to this day.

develange
wrote on November 4 2009 @ 09:28 pm: [report]

gah, I don’t think I could handle an open relationship. I would go into a homicidal cave woman rage.

Sometimes I feel threatened when I see some attractive woman I don’t know making googly eyes at my boyfriend. But I trust him, and he doesn’t reciprocate. If I saw him flirting—and flirting is flirting, it is NOT the same as just talking—I would be threatened, jealous, and pissed. Would I consider it cheating? Probably not. But I’d definitely consider it disrespectful, and feel insecure.

Reading many of the comments on here—it amazes me what people will and can tolerate. I would go CRAZY if the man I loved was going off with women, hitting on them, lying about it. I would not be able to take the immense jealously, insecurity and pain. I’d probably end up trying to kill someone.

onewriter
wrote on November 4 2009 @ 09:45 pm: [report]

ditto for me.

novel_idea
wrote on November 5 2009 @ 12:08 am: [report]

It all so depends on the situation. I’ve been married (twice) to my SO/best friend for lots of years, and we’ve had an open marriage much like MrB describes for the whole time. Lately, though, this system hasn’t been working well because of secrecy, half-truths and outright lies, which absolutely shocked me coming from my best friend and especially since it started some time after she and her friend (who is also my friend) openly and with my approval became sexually intimate. The worst has been totally losing my ability to believe what she says. It seems even harder after such a long and close time together, with children, lots of shared history…  How does one get through this loss of trust? Unfortunately, I don’t feel like I’m in any position to offer advice to anyone above, although I can certainly empathize with most. I’ve been working on “it really doesn’t matter much in the larger scope of things”. We have a good life together, it’s just missing that fullness that comes with sincere trust. If you can’t trust someone to tell you the truth, how can you trust them emotionally?

catmcroy
wrote on November 6 2009 @ 01:45 am: [report]

For me it’s cheating if it’s something I wouldn’t do in front of my partner. We have an open relationship - that was something we mutually agreed on at the start (it wasn’t one or the other of us saying “this is how it HAS to be”, it was more both of us said “hey this is something we both want and are prepared for.). Then again we are also both in our 30s too…It involves a lot of discussion and trust, and there are ground rules in place. BTW: re jealousy? I only feel jealous if I feel like a need is being unmet so the mature thing is I tell my partner “I am feeling insecure because need A is being unmet by you but I see you doing behaviour B that meets need A with her.” Now the ball’s in his court - and we both have agreed we’re each other’s main relationship and safe person to come home to.