Debate This: Should You Live Together Before Marriage?

Lindsay Goldenberg
wrote on December 1 2008 @ 11:57 am: [report]

Great debate! I have to say I agree with Teri (I also know how happy her and her hubby are.)

I think when you’re in a good relationship, moving in together will not break the relationship. If it does, then waiting until you got married would have been an even bigger disaster.

I also think we need to re-evaluate how we’re using “freedom” in regards to our living spaces. Saying you want to be “free” for as long as possible by living on your own (even though you’re with the “right” partner) makes marriage sound like some sort of prison. This viewpoint is probably why most marriages end in divorce. If you’re trying to live your last days of “freedom” by living by yourself, then marriage will just seem like a life sentence to you.

The benefits of living with someone you love are not simply b/c it’s cheaper and you can have nicer things…it’s because you’re starting your life with someone, and sharing everyday experiences with them. You shouldn’t have to avoid it.

Michelle
wrote on December 1 2008 @ 01:55 pm: [report]

I agree with Teri and Lindsay. “Enjoying your last minutes of freedom” is not a reason to not live with your significant other before getting married, I might be very romantic about this, but I think that sharing your space with someone doesn’t mean you’re no longer free, it only means you grew up and realized that pretending to be a teenager forever leads to nowhere but solitude and frustration. My boyfriend and I have decided we’re moving in together after three years of relationship and I must say I’m still freaking out a little: I have never before shared my space,  but the more I think about it, the weaker that argument sounds. Plus, the idea of being with him without thinking about how late it is getting and I have to get back home to do something, or he has, overshadows my natural fear of failure.

Elle
wrote on December 1 2008 @ 02:58 pm: [report]

“I’d rather have a smaller TV or less money to spend on clothes than have to deal with someone else’s BS”

Wow.  I’m sorry, but Tracie’s POV strikes me as very juvenile.  So you should wait until you are married to deal with someone else’s BS?  What if you can’t deal?  Are you ready to be a divorcee or will you just stick it out in misery just because you’re married? 

I think living with someone before marriage is crucial to figuring out whether that person is in fact the one you want to spend the rest of your life with.  Love plays a large factor in your relationship, but trust me there are lots of other things at play other than love that could make or break your relationship. 

I personally would not want to be blindsided by something that I simply could not live with about my partner.  I lived with my husband for almost 2 years before we got engaged and we learned a lot about each other and how to deal with problems together and communicate effectively with one another.  Sharing money, and responsibilities is just another layer on top of that, it’s not the WHOLE reason to live with someone.

joyy
wrote on December 1 2008 @ 11:30 pm: [report]

Why is it still the default that all women in a relationship are expected to want to get married?  My boyfriend and I are mutually disinterested in marriage and we’ve been living together for a year and a half (dating for 3 years).  I’m not sure if we’ll be together ‘forever’ because I think those terms are unrealistic, as proven by the divorce rate in this country.  We love each other and love sharing our lives together, and that’s that. 

As for the needing your own freedom as an argument against cohabitation?  Bull.  If you want to wait, then my all means, do what makes you happy.  But if you are in a relationship or marriage where you no longer feel as though you can retain your identity, you have bigger problems to solve than housing issues. 

The beauty of our relationship has always been that we don’t hold each other back.  I decide three months into our relationship that I’m moving to Asia for the summer to teach English?  He’s jealous that I’m traveling.  He wants to move to the desert to rock climb for three months even though I can only make it out there every other weekend or so?  I miss him but I deal with it.  We drive each other to be better people and have both grown considerably during our relationship. 

Bottom line?  Do what works for you - then stfu.

par3
wrote on December 2 2008 @ 03:43 am: [report]

if perfect strangers could live together in college and people make that out to be ‘an experience you have to have in life’ then why is it so taboo to live with someone you love while trying to build a life? maybe that TOO is an experience you ought to have in life as well- whether it works out in the end or not.

i really do believe living with someone who you love and are romantic with makes you learn a lot about yourself and who you are. it’s easy to be with someone when you’re being ‘theirs’ only when you want to but what about when you have to be with that someone all the time- dare i say- for better or for worse?

sharing a space with another person puts your personality and beliefs to the test. you’ll find yourself in situations where you’ll question everything/yourself. i think this is something that helps build character and possibly even help young adults figure out what they really want in life- in a partner- and other more complex things that out minds conjure up.

Lynn
wrote on December 3 2008 @ 05:08 pm: [report]

I don’t plan on living with anyone before I get married. I just don’t want to get THAT tangled in with someone, and then not leave him (and eventually marry him) just because it was too hard to walk away. I’ve seen it happen too many times - one of my cousins just got out of a 3-year relationship with a guy. They lived together for 2 years. She was really unhappy for about a year of that, but was afraid to break up with him because it would rock her home life so completely. I hate that she wasted a year of her life knowing that she wanted out, but not having enough strength to get out. Another cousin of mine owns a house and a dog with her boyfriend, 11 hours away from any of her family. I don’t think she’s happy, but she hasn’t left him yet. I’m sure it’s because their lives are so intertwined now that it’s hard to leave.

Honestly, I don’t have *any* friends, family, or acquaintances who have ever said “man, I’m so glad I lived with my ex-boyfriend for three years.” Most of them have only said “that was a huge mistake, and I wasted so much time and energy on him just because we lived together.”

I guess I figure that having intertwined lives (and, therefore, relationships that are hard to leave) is a good thing in a marriage. The practical aspects of living together make you stick it out and try to work it out instead of just giving up and divorcing. But in an unmarried relationship, I don’t want that kind of commitment or those kind of ties. If I ever move in with a man, I want him to be the only and last man I ever live with. And if I’m ready for that, then I’m ready to get married.

Nacho
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 10:52 am: [report]

I think Tracie’s comments are very naive and shortsighted. She’s comparing living with a partner and learning about compromise to “oh no, I’d rather have freedom! and time to myself! and me me me!” It’s a very immature way of thinking about this situation.

I moved in with my boyfriend of (then) two years because it seemed to be the next logical phase of our relationship. We went through two years of a long-distance relationship, and we stayed at each others’ apartments while visiting (we were both in college at the time). When we moved in together, we had to make a lot of compromises, but we made them out of love and sacrifice for one another. We’ve also made major joint purchases (like our queen bed, which we LOVE) and are planning on buying a house before getting married.

It’s just that we were ready for that kind of thing. We don’t see a long-term relationship as being “trapped” with one another, nor do we see marriage that way. We love being around one another and support one another in most everything we want to accomplish, and we’re still happily in love after four years. Haha, even after having lived together for two!

Anyway, that was a really long way of saying, if you feel comfortable and believe that it’s the next step, and if you’re not feeling as if you’re losing out on something or are going to feel “trapped,” I’d say go for it. If not, then obviously, keep that time and your space to yourself.

EastCoastMale
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 10:59 am: [report]

I think this is an issue that depends on so many variables that are unique not only to relationship health at the time but also the two people involved. If you aren’t even getting married and want to live together as BF and GF then have at it, if it goes well great, if not then breakup and move on. Thinking it is harder to breakup with someone you live with, to me, doesn’t resonate as a valid argument but rather a backhanded way of saying “I only want to live with someone I am 0 sure will never breakup/leave me, I cant take the chance”. I have lived with a LTRL and it went fine, we weren’t planning on marriage and in the end it wasn’t fire and brimstone when we went our separate ways. To me, no matter how close you are to someone or how many times you spend consecutive nights at there house or whatever, you truly learn things about yourself and the other person by actually living together. For those who want to wait until marriage and then go that route, just my opinion but good luck with that.

EastCoastMale
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 11:00 am: [report]

that jumbled mess is a one hundred percent sign, forgot the post effes it up.

scb197
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 11:35 am: [report]

neither of these people have very strong arguments. he’s the person who annoys her most? wow, cuz that’s a good reason. and a small tv? awesome. whatever works best for you, is what you should do.

retro chic
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 12:14 pm: [report]

I don’t like these “either/or options,” in human relationships, esp, when one is flat out silly. It’s all a crap shoot anyway, as me and any of my friends of every domestic combo possible can attest.

Imo, it’s such an individual thing with too many moving parts (with personalities, upbringing, circumstances, baggage, goals, etc), to have a set “right” path. Love, luck, commitment and trusting your gut are the only sure guidelines to pull you thru either approach (cohab first or not) and have reasonable expectations of growth and happiness… the desired outcome presumably?

That said, Lindsay shouldn’t have silly ideas of rampant freedom til the last minute, and expect to be taken seriously in a relationship, let alone a marriage. wow.

As some of us have observed, people are different when they’re married than when they’re living together, no matter how many years logged during cohab b/c of the ever-changing dynamics named above. Hopefully, that translates into more growth and love.

DR
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 05:41 pm: [report]

I have done both - been married and lived with someone (co-habitated doesn’t reflect the emotional bond).  I found that in the relationship in which I lived with someone, there was less clarity for me around the committment and expectation.  I felt like we were two individuals co-habitating and making love.  When I was married, I felt like I was part of a unit, and I understood my role to be the primary decisionmaker and trustee in the event of a catastrophe and a lack of capacity on the part of my partner.  It was more than splitting the bills and making love.  I want to share that special feeling of belonging and committment that I experienced when I was married.  If I can’t say that I will marry the person, I don’t want to live with that person.  It’s that simple.

fifi
wrote on May 28 2009 @ 07:54 pm: [report]

I have seen many couples live together only after they got married and ended up growing old together. I also know some couples who cohabitate and didn’t even bother to formalize their relationship with marriage but has stood the test of time. From what I observe, it’s not really about whether you’re married or not when you decide to move in together. It just has to be for the right reasons. Convenience is the lamest excuse. So is merely being needy for an everyday companion. There has to be the commitment to share life together, not just big, special moments, but also everyday, routine annoyances. And also important, the relationship has to be past the honeymoon stage already. You have a realistic view of each other’s personalities and you love and appreciate each other for that.

teal
wrote on June 21 2009 @ 09:09 pm: [report]

I’ve been doing a lot of reading concerning live-in relationships before marriage.  Basically I gather that there are two strong opinions: either you are pro-live-in or you are anti-live-in. 

Pros seem to be a more modern group of individuals and believe that living together before marriage will offer a good way to really, really know who you will be marrying. 

Antis seem to be more traditional/conservative, almost always religious, and believe that living together is morally wrong and will lead to a higher divorce rate.  And give reasons why living together prior to marriage is a bad idea due to higher divorce rates which is a fact, but offered some junk that I thought was ridiculous in order to persuade others out of it.

Personally, I am all for living together before marriage definitely to make sure the man was someone I can be with for the rest of my life, but only if both parties are mature enough in the relationship.  I have had two serious relationships, and lived with both of them.  The first serious relationship obviously did not work out.  And the only reason it did not work out was because I saw a totally different side of him when we were both going through the downs as in any relationship.  All I have to say is this different behavior from him is definitely NEVER okay in a marriage.  So that relationship ended and I would have never learned this side of him had I not lived with him.  And you know what, we were very much in love before moving in together.  At that time, if he proposed I would’ve said yes.  We would’ve been married and soon divorced, so great thing I lived with him first.

Now I’m with my current serious boyfriend of three years.  Living with him has taken our relationship even further.  There was adjustment and compromise.  Although I loved him before moving in with him, I have to say my love for him is much more profound now after seeing who he was behind closed doors.  He’s still the same man I fell in love with, but now I know I love him on a deeper level despite the extreme downs that life can throw at us.

And back to the argument of it being a horrible idea to live together before marriage.  Sure the facts show divorce rates are higher.  But what about the couples that get married before living together?  Almost always they choose not to do this based on religious reasons, and stats show religious couples have a lower rate of divorce.  Sure that’s great, but are they really happy?  They might as well be divorced and happy…

Also some make the argument that living together is just a way to evade actually getting married, hence the saying that has something to do with why buy a cow whilst you can get the milk for free.  I’m not good at memorizing these things.  But the point is why is it either get married first then the couple can finally go to the next step, or nothing at all?  Do we really have to force the man into marrying you in order to have a “complete” relationship?  With this mentality it wouldn’t turn out well anyway.

dukeofmadtown
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 12:41 pm: [report]

The bottom line is this: Cohabitating is not marriage. Studies show you are less likely to have a successful happy marriage if you cohabitate first. Because there is no commitment in living together, behaviors, communication, finances, etc. are handled in a completely different way than if you were married. It is a myth that it makes marriage easier… in reality it makes it harder. After cohabitating for years, you then have to figure out how a marriage works, AND IT DOES NOT WORK THE SAME!

If you really care about your partner and you think that he/she could be the one… don’t move in together. But if all you want is to save money and have sex then by all means cohabitate.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 12:44 pm: [report]

@dukeofmadtown: GTFO. Hey I can make everything capitals too.

SaraB
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 03:04 pm: [report]

@dukeofmadtown: wow, that’s kind of absurd. I may be biased because I live with my partner (of three years), but I would say there’s a commitment there. If one of us screws something up, leaves the door unlocked or forgets to pay our half of the bill, then we both suffer.

I think living together before marriage is a really good idea in general, but it depends on the couple. The way those studies are reported is total bollocks. Anyone who’s studied statistics ever knows that correlation does not equal causation! There could very well be some third factor (oh say, immaturity?) that causes the same people who live together for the wrong reasons, to get married for the wrong reasons. My partner and I have been together three years and I have learned things since we’ve lived together that I never knew about him before. I would hate to have to find out that he leaves his socks lying around in the living room immediately upon returning from our honeymoon.

We love each other, but mostly we are committed to making things equal and giving each other a happy home life, something neither of us has really had. Maybe it’s because neither of us is particularly religious, but although we do intend to get married someday, eventually, the only difference will be tax forms and wedding presents. We are already planning to spend the rest of our lives together, so to us, breaking up is no more an option than divorce is to a married couple. I didn’t move in with him because I wanted to “shack up.” I moved in with him because I want him to be the first person I see in the morning and the last one I see before I go to bed, for the rest of my life. Isn’t that what the religious ideal of marriage is supposed to be about anyway?

GinnyL
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 03:15 pm: [report]

In spite of CheeeeEEEEse scintillating, informative, and constructive response to dukeofmadtown, the latter is correct in his/her assessment of cohabitation versus marriage. My husband and I lived together five years before we married each other. We will have been married 24 years this Monday. 

An earlier post stated that she didn’t necessarily expect to live with her partner forever. Going into a marriage with that mindset is entering the marriage with a lack of commitment, whether she even realizes that or not. And cohabitation is NOT the same as marriage, much as many of us wish it were! The commitment factor is definitely different, emotionally as well as legally.

lawyrgrl
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 03:23 pm: [report]

@GinnyL I have to say that I rather liked CheeEEse’s response.  Such a dismissive remark deserved a dismissive response.  Seriously, who the hell is he to hand out pronouncements of “the bottom line?”

@dukeofmadtown Dad?  Is that you?

joyy
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 03:29 pm: [report]

@GinnyL - if someone doesn’t expect to live together with someone forever, they probably don’t plan on getting married ... duh.  (not sure if that was my comment you were referring to, in which case your point is irrelevant, or someone else’s).

GinnyL
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 03:54 pm: [report]

The abstract for the U of Denver’s article in regard to the topic under discussion is below. The journal is one of the APA’s journals. Very hard to get published in their journals so usually only the best research shows up.

Pre-engagement cohabitation and gender asymmetry in marital commitment.
Rhoades, Galena Kline; Stanley, Scott M.; Markman, Howard J.
Journal of Family Psychology. Vol 20(4), Dec 2006, 553-560.
Abstract

  1. The authors longitudinally examined couples’ (N = 197) dedication (interpersonal commitment) levels on the basis of their premarital cohabitation history. Findings suggested that men who cohabited with their spouse before engagement were less dedicated than men who cohabited only after engagement or not at all before marriage. Furthermore, these husbands were less dedicated to their wives than their wives were to them. Hierarchical linear modeling showed that such asymmetries were apparent before marriage and through the early years of marriage. Relationship adjustment and religiousness were related to dedication but did not account for the findings. The authors suggest that couples considering cohabitation before engagement could benefit from discussions about commitment and expectations about marriage. (PsycINFO Database Record (c) 2008 APA, all rights reserved)

http://psycnet.apa.org/index.cfm?fa=search.displayRecord&id=1ACEC78D-DFE3-F50D-9BB9-0DC5D60A1970&resultID=4&page=1&dbTab=pa

joyy, I don’t know if it was one of your comments I referred to or not but, unfortunately, the number of people who marrying with the idea that if it doesn’t work out, we can always divorce is probably higher than either of us would guess.

Lawyrgrl: I loved your comment, @dukeofmadtown Dad?  Is that you? Absolutely cracked me up!

Saint
wrote on August 14 2009 @ 04:07 pm: [report]

I’m one of those people who can see both sides of this argument.

I’m getting married next year. In a very religious church. We recently had to jump through hoops to be approved to be married *in* the church.. why? Because we live together.

We’ve dated for five years. Lived together for three. What changed the church’s mind? Do you see any timelines in this study?

I’m not sure where, but other studies have shown that if you live together for over two years.. you’re past the “danger point” for divorce. In fact, your marriage actually has a better chance of surviving. I got this information from my pastor - a man who staunchly opposed cohabitating before marriage.

Frankly, if you live with a partner, and sharing fluids, you should share everything. We don’t have a joint account yet (why make more problems after the name change next year?) for rent or bills, but we still split it evenly—he’ll pay all of the bills, and then take half out of my rent so we’re still financial equals. 

We’ve both been through life-changing events, and we’ve discovered how our relationship helps each of us grow as individuals. We’ve learned to support each other.

Apex317
wrote on August 15 2009 @ 05:11 pm: [report]

I truly understand the benefits of living togehter, financially, (esp in today’s economy) but like everything- there’s consequences to it as well that are worth considering. Is the shortcut worth it?  As many of you have come from “broken” homes, life takes on a new perspective from the traditional method of waiting.  Because you know someone who has failed in marriage, does that mean that the principle behind waiting is flawed?  No. As being one who has tried it, and am now married (to someone else mind you), I have a valuable comment to make here.  When you bounce into this before being married, you ruin a lot of the best parts of it.  In other words, if you live together first…what makes getting married special anymore??  So, most will end up spoiling this special time ordained by God, even if they marry someone else later.  Just because we live life in an instant gratification era, does not make some things right.  Personally, I think it takes more authentic love (on both sides), discipline, and focus to not live together and to keep it that way until you choose to get married. The living together is the easy part, why rush it?  I challenge you readers who are debating this idea to not spend yourself.  Some things you spend you can not get totally back, the most important of those things is YOU!  You are worth not spending yourself on some girl/guy who’s a maybe.  Look at all the cheating that goes on in those situations when people live together. You think its easy to seperate all your stuff when someone feels they have been betrayed…or just simply wants to move on in life?? There’s heartache and detachment, sometimes violence.  Why put yourself through that test?  While you are dating, you can focus on yourself, and not be influenced with someone living in your area. It can cloud your judgment. And the sex?? Sure, its there too, and great at first..but then when you get married..what’s left to learn or experience?  You ruined that experience for yourself.  There are consequences in life for taking the easy road.  You hear this, you are taught this, if you are foolish enough not to heed wisdom from others, then you get what you deserve…its that simple.  Living like your married when your not is a slippery slope, do what you know is right and work for something.  You always hear about these happy old couples that have been married for 50+ years.  Do you think they lived together first….probably not.

holleh
wrote on August 16 2009 @ 10:19 pm: [report]

Its not fair to compare co-habitation before marriage to test-driving a car before purchasing. A test drive is a committment of a few minutes. Dating is test-driving. Marriage should be a lifetime committment. If two people are serious enough to move in with someone, why do most people still treat it like “dating”? Like there is no committment, but they are literally merging their lives?
Yes, I believe its wrong to live together or even have sex before marriage. Sure, the temptations are very strong because everyone else seems to be doing it… movies teach it… pop music glorifies it… but what does it really bring to your life to have multiple partners? Most people want someone to grow old with… but will that perfect someone want all the baggage that you have in your past - and would you want the burden of someone else’s past? Multiple failed relationships and multiple sexual partners does not sound very appealing.
How difficult it must be to end a relationship in which you have lived with someone… must feel a lot like divorce.
Its better to keep things simple - like it was in the old days. May sound boring, but there was sure a lot less divorce and broken families. Both my parents came from broken homes. They promised each other they would not go through that pain with their own families. And they are still together 35 years later! Thats what I want for my spouse and children as well. A committment to stay together and CHOOSE to love each other every day. No backsies.

holleh
wrote on August 16 2009 @ 10:32 pm: [report]

By the way, VERY well said, Apex317.

staceface
wrote on August 16 2009 @ 11:28 pm: [report]

@holleh:

I was raised in a Christian home with all the normal rules and ideas about life, but I have to say, you are living in a fantasy world if you are actually glorifying “the old days.”

Seriously?  Women were completely powerless to have any say in their marriages, which is why marriages in “the old days” were successful.  Women knew they couldn’t have a life after getting divorced, because of societal norms and prejudices, so they stuck it out in terrible marriages.  People were buying in to some antiquated notion about staying together no matter what, despite abuse, cheating, and whatever else the man felt like inflicting.  Do you really think this is what a loving God would want for his children?  Regardless, there is nothing justifiable about praising “the old days” as some sort of great example of what marriage should be.  More accurate as an example of how a male-dominated society viewed women as objects, and marriages held double standards for men and women.  (Ie:  It’s expected that men cheat because it’s their nature, but women were expected to be faithful and turn a blind eye to the cheating.)  There were no happy old days of marriage, just societal pressures and constrictions that stripped women of choices.  That’s why there were fewer divorces.  You may have noticed that the divorce rate went up when women became sexually liberated?  Not a coincidence.

(But wait,let me guess, you think women shouldn’t be sexually liberated?  We should be barefoot in the kitchen and totally content with whatever our husbands decide to do?)

I personally would not live with someone before marriage, but that’s based on the research.  I’m a psychologist,and @GinnyL makes an excellent point.  Research shows that the mindset differs between marriage and cohabitation, and cohabitors are less successful in marriage.  So, yes, in that sense, I suppose I am traditional, but I am certainly not judging anyone who wants to live together.  Best of luck to them!

Either way, people are responsible for attending to their own happiness.  Relationships do take work, and the choice to be happy and in love, no matter where you live.

melodymom
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 08:36 am: [report]

I have a little bit of a different story.  My husband and I met as freshmen in college.  We were best friends, dated other people, and began living together as friends in a house of 4 housemates.  We lived together for five years while getting bachelor’s and master’s degrees, and during those five years, our friendship wasn’t always platonic, but we were never officially BF-GF.  Still, our friendship deepened.

When we looked for jobs after finishing our time in college, we looked in the same places and ended up moving across the country together.  But even then, we somehow didn’t realize we were heading for marriage.

It was only after living together for a year after college that I reluctantly decided that I should probably get a place of my own.  Only when I began making plans to get my own apartment did we both start to realize how much we wanted and needed to stay together.  After seven years of friendship, five of which were spent living together, we realized how compatible we were, how in love we were, how inseparable we were, and how happy we made each other.  We have now been married for 13 wonderful years and have 3 beautiful children.  We have our ups and downs, but we communicate, work through our problems together, consider one another’s feelings, and do everything as life partners.  I absolutely cherish those 5 years of living together, and know that without that time, we may never have realized that we were soul mates.

Statistics are meaningless.  The people are what makes a situation work or not work.

LunaLena
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:59 am: [report]

@Apex317 ... wow, you’re making a lot of assumptions about other people there.  The fact that you refer to marriage as “this special time ordained by God” says a lot to me.  One of the many things it says is that you’re already biased against living together because man and woman can only be blessed by God if they’re married.  Out of curiosity, are you against women choosing to stay single too?

It sounds to me like you lived with someone, got cheated on, and broke up with a lot of heartache and fights about who gets to keep what.  You’re right when you say that, just because one comes from a broken home doesn’t mean that the concept of waiting until marriage is flawed.  But on the flip side, just because YOU (or someone you know) had a bad experience cohabiting, it doesn’t mean that the idea of living together first is flawed either.  A lot of people on this board alone have disproved that already, and I wholeheartedly agree that it depends on the people involved.

You say “if you live together first…what makes getting married special anymore?”, and later, in talking about sex, said “when you get married..what’s left to learn or experience?  You ruined that experience for yourself.” You make it sound like living together makes you completely stagnant.  I’ve always been on the fence about cohabiting, but your arguments actually push me towards pro-cohabitation.  ANY relationship, cohabiting-married-or-none-of-the-above, will get stagnant if you never try anything new.  Let’s follow your line of thought for a moment here: a couple waits to get married to have sex and live together.  For a year or two, they blissfully and joyfully learn all about each other.  And then… what?  By your reasoning, once they’ve learned about their partners, there’s no surprises left, so where’s the joy in marriage going to be?  The only difference I can see between this and living together first is that, rather than divvying up their stuff themselves, they’re going to be paying their divorce lawyers to do it for them.

Every relationship, married or not, needs to move forward, not stay in the same place.  Your arguments suggest that you think relationships hit a plateau and then nothing changes after that.  Personally, I think that if a relationship is going to eventually stand still like that, it’s better to find out before legal entanglements and possibly children enter the picture.  Otherwise, the couple may get bored with each other and commit adultery or covet their neighbor’s husbands/wives or do other things God frowns on during that “special time ordained by God.”

You also said “Look at all the cheating that goes on in these situations…” What about all the cheating that goes on between people who are NOT living together, or worse, the cheating that goes on between people who are married?

@ holleh, finding the person who’s right for you and waiting to have sex and get married sounds good in theory, but you’re assuming that no one will ever get it wrong that they’ve found the right person.  You make it sound like “multiple failed relationships” is a bad thing, but how else are you supposed to learn what you want in a partner, or what you can’t tolerate?  When I was young and stupid (and I still am, in some ways), I thought I knew what I wanted.  And then I found someone who had all those qualities that I thought I wanted, and I discovered that that old Star Trek quote about wanting being more pleasant than having is true.  Some of those qualities I thought were necessary?  Turns out they drove me crazy, in a bad way.  I don’t think my current relationship would be nearly as happy and successful as it is now if I hadn’t learned all that then.

mily
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 11:09 am: [report]

I think living together before marriage is wrong because of the implications of the sex life involved. Since sexual relationships involve the possible birth o a new human life, this new person has the right to be born from parents who have already committed themselves to live permanently together. That is the best place for his/her upbringing and education, his/her own parents, both of them.

holleh
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 11:38 am: [report]

@staceface:
I would NEVER say to a woman (or a man) that is being abused or mistreated in some way that she ought to stay with their husband or wife because they were married and that she would have to put up with whatever they wanted. Nope. Marriage should be a union between two equals. I am all for women’s lib, but I think some ladies tend to try to beat men up because of how the past has played out. Nor, do I think that one should find an excuse to get divorced.
I tend to be more traditional, but (surprise) I actually am the bread winner in the house and my husband stays home with the kids. So, our household is a little less traditional that the typical household in the past.
Just because I disagree with you does not mean that I am judging you. No harm was intended. This is my point of view, based on Biblical principals.
@lunalena: Does finding the right person mean that you have to live with them or have sex with them in order to find out if they are the right “one”? True love should not require this. I am not saying its not tempting and that people dont make mistakes… but that should not be a test of love. If you dont know enough about a person, there are other ways get to know them, non-sexually. Why would you want to be with someone that has had multiple partners? Disease is just one of the many concerns.
My husband and I just celebrated our 8th anniversary. Through all the life changes we have gone through as a young couple in this short amount of time, I dont think we could have made it through the hard times without the committment of marriage. It would have been so easy to give up if we did not have that “for better or worse” committment.
Again, no offense is intended toward anyone. Its irritating when one gets thrashed just because they dont agree with mainstream ideas.

Lynn
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 03:59 pm: [report]

@mily - but in that situation, do you have a problem with people actually living together, or with the premarital sex? You can have sex without living together; you can live together without having sex.

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 04:39 pm: [report]

I received an equal amount of people who agreed that its best to save living together for marriage and those not. Then one response from a psychologist who said both views are ok. Talk about wishy-washy, I believe I would come away more confused then before the advice. In my opinion, a relationship will be more rewarding if you wait until you are married to live together.  Who wants an old used tire? There is a toll that living together takes on one emotionally, beyond having a relationship in seperate homes.  Its a view of selfishness in a way, (Really this is the root of most problems in life..think about it.)  Its a “I want it now” mentality or just fear by wanting to be- “one-foot in, one-foot out.” I can get out just in case.  Well- if that’s the view, then whats going to change it for you? Living together most likely won’t change that desire…you have your cake now, half of it.  Marriage requires both feet in, fully-committed, saying no to some things you didn’t before, holding your tongue, serving your mate first,..etc.  I’ll bet you know where I’m going to tell you where to find those qualities of marriage. Also, consider pre-marital living together- what if a child does come along? (and you’re not ready..) or something else serious comes up between you two? You now have your feet in concrete and cant escape like you planned without a mess. You dont want to marry this person, you may think. So what’s the next step…abortion of that little life? Split-up and rob your child of a two-parent home? Or go ahead and marry this person…resenting the feeling of being trapped with someone you don’t love enough. Thats a problem, but those are risks you take. Pretty serious stress. Then what about STD’s. You want to take that risk with your life and future family.  Its just not a wise investment, its an Sunday ice cream cone, then its gone. Then what? Another comment about the “good old days” is somewhat true. Women were mistreated and had very little freedoms most of last century, but today is very different for women. So how does that excuse work now to be fearful of marriage?  Sounds like this view should avoid marriage until they resolve those fears. Also, keep in mind there were very good marriages years ago too. Look-those who live together with NO intent on ever getting married…go for it! However, I believe if you do value marriage and want that for yourself one day….wait for that time. Get your act together on your own and date this person seperate from living with them. Take the steps to get to know them without the co-habitating. Its really not worth it.  Do you believe you can not make it on your own? You need to have this person living in your home to have a happy marriage? No. You are putting your faith and effort in the wrong place.  Undeniably, I can not evade the principles taught in the Bible concerning this…that is where one’s focus should be in a single life, not in that person you wish to gamble on with your life. Christian or not, the solid life teachings in the Bible do measure true success. But there’s no place for a selfish ambition or prideful heart in learning this.  That person will never see the goodness and intrinsic help there.  King Solomon (an actual historical figure) said, vanity, vanity, all is vanity.  This man had all the riches you could have, and he came to find out that what the world finds important (media, advertisers)offers little importance in the greater scope of life. Check his life story out for yourself- you’ll be surprised how right he is.  I expect to receive rebuttal on this message, but if you look to Shakespere, scientists, and other theorists on life…why not look in the pages of the Bible? If you don’t understand it, there are plenty of resources online to help..and its really interesting as well to learn. Tune off the mags, ETV, and all the peer pressures for awhile. Spend a little time here if you haven’t.  This isn’t intended to be a PSA for the Bible…but I’m nearly 40, spent most of my early years living with girlfriends and such….there’s really no true answers there.  You might be kidding yourself. However, one I put away all that garbage thinking years later and emotional toll later…I finally seriously looked to the Bible and church from a friend.  There was the answer after all those years. Finally, I met my wife. Great woman! We have a beautiful son and a daughter on the way. But the foundation of your life must be set first on solid ground.  Learning the lessons of wisdom in the Bible set the course for me. Otherwise, I would have still been living that transient life of uncertainty.  This is long post it seems, but I encourage those of you with questions to investigate what the Bible says.  Here’s a really good resource to learn more, it really helped me figure out some of these debates in life- http://www.harvest.org  I wish you all well in your life decisions!

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 04:42 pm: [report]

Not going to read that. Someone summarize it for me.

joyy
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 04:55 pm: [report]

@cheese - your comment inspired me to bother with it.

- people who live together before marriage are the moral equivalent of “old used tires”

- problems that couples have aren’t problems if you’re married, but ruin your life (and contribute to that old tire smell) if you’re living together before marriage (whether you want to eventually get married to the person or not)

- if the good old days style of doing things worked for people back then, even if they were miserable, think about how much better that mindset will be now that women have like, rights and stuff!

- bible bible bible

- holding out til after tying the knot worked for him, therefore it will obviously be the best choice for everyone else as well (even though he admits to having cohabitated before in other relationships and that doesn’t seem to have prevented him from having what sounds like a satisfying, lasting marriage to his wife)

However, I was amused to see my own lifestyle choices validated: “Look-those who live together with NO intent on ever getting married…go for it!”  woohoo!

Sofjna
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 05:52 pm: [report]

@joyy- wow, I’m impressed you read that whole thing; I got bored about a third of the way down. 

Although, I wonder what he would have to say about my parents- they did everything the “right” way and got divorced in less than ten years because my dad was having an affair.  My aunt and uncle on the other hand- not only did they live together but she got pregnant before getting married, and they’re still happy over thirty years later.  Hmmm…
What works for one, does not work for everyone.

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:30 pm: [report]

Well Joyy- I cant blame you for the tone of your response. Not everyone is meant to be or chooses to be married in their life. My post is more directed to those who do have that desire..which is probably most people out there. “Old tire” means lot of wear and tear over the years of repetitious relationships living with people. Even after living in these situations for years with different people, it was hard to recall the newness of a relationship, even in my marriage.  I ruined it. I’ve talked to others who felt the same. It can wear on you, and it can take a lot more effort to recapture that newness when you get married. Its taken time. However, I can look back and see that even though I was able to enjoy the living arrangements at the time, they were temporary. I know if I had been more careful and diciplined to not allow a relationship to go in that direction, I would still have some of that newness to enjoy in my marriage…like my wife does. It can take a toll, and it does come with a cost.  I also noticed your contempt for my mention of the Bible as a source of good life principles.  Why?  What’s your reasons to be against it? 

I can see why many people are miffed by Christianity. For one, the fall of people who are Christian leaders is bad. However, they are human, the key is for them to get back up and try harder not to do it again, really mean it.  But does that mean the teachings of the Bible themselves are flawed? No.  As someone who has lived the playboy lifestyle all over this great nation and experienced lots of adventures many people have not had the chance…I can say when I dedicated my life to Christ, it made everything so much better. Peace, true peace- never existed laying in bed next to someone I was not married to. It was a facade in my case.  I will continue to advocate my life change due to becoming a Christian. Its been the best thing, and you would not have caught me saying this 10 years ago.

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:38 pm: [report]

I’m no wordsmith and generally not a friend to proofreading, I say whats in my heart and submit as written.  What I meant to say about Christian leaders who fail is that we all are human, we all make mistakes. However, that does not mean that the teachings of the Bible themselves are flawed.  Although, many people try to make that correlation.  They are a blueprint to follow for a successful Godly life.  And, yes, there is more to it than living a “good life” alone.  Not that it requires more good, but when one applies their heart and mind to what’s taught, the benefits are far, far better for you then the former.

joyy
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:51 pm: [report]

@Apex - I take issue when anyone points to anything, religion or not, as an end-all be-all how to guide to a happy life for everyone.  What works for you does not work for everyone, no matter what text you point to for it. 

Discussing why I personally choose not to base my life on the teachings of the bible is a bit off topic for this thread.  That said, I do try to recall the positive things I garnered from my christian upbringing, and none of those things were brought up in your rant.  You know, the whole love your neighbor and judge not lest ye be judged stuff (to name a few things).

*sam*
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:52 pm: [report]

@Apex: you are certainly entitled to your own opinions, but WOW. after reading your posts, I’m going to go puke up a bible now.

joyy
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:54 pm: [report]

@Apex - also, “bible bible bible” is about as non-judgemental of a summary you’re ever going to get when you point to scripture when telling others how to live their lives.

*sam*
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:56 pm: [report]

@joyy: don’t worry, I have a feeling that he is going to realize very soon that this probably isn’t the best site for him.

Sofjna
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 06:59 pm: [report]

@sam- cute sick face smiley.  You’ve been spending too much time with _jsw_.

*sam*
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 07:03 pm: [report]

@sofjna: ah, you know my secret!!! darn, & I thought I had him all to myself!!

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 07:17 pm: [report]

I am confident in my beliefs and what has made a complete turnaround in my personal life for the better and I’ll continue to share this with others. There are people who will find a true positive change in life like I did.  Christ’s word has survived the persecution of the Great Roman Empire of which itself fell.  I suspect it will continue to exist long after you and I are way gone. I do respect the substance of what you three have expressed, and all you have said in regards to your life. I wish the three of you the best for your lives.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:09 pm: [report]

@apex: It survived the Romans because of Constantine, not from divine intervention. A man did this. If the word you speak is gods word, how do you account for the schisms before, Judaism, and after, Islam?

I love how people claim to follow Christ, but didn’t know he was Jewish. If you were a true follower of Christ wouldn’t you be Jewish, or if not, practiced Judaism previously before converting?

It’s easy to be an idiot on the internet, it’s impossible to be right. So just shut the hell up and everyone wins.

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:14 pm: [report]

And,yes Sam and Joyy, the Bible strongly teaches to love one another and that one will be judged by the same measure you judge another.  That is probably the fewest words of instructions given to us by Jesus, but also the most powerful. It is also (as proven in our world) one of the most difficult to do purely.  To love one another the way Christ wants us to is really hard due to our biases, but also that type of love demonstrated to others is the best.  Any system needs structure to stand, and function…from a galaxy to the components of a human cell. I believe that God provides us the rules of how to live in the Bible, not to restrict us, (even though it may seem that way) but rather to protect us from ourselves because He loves us. It sounds weird, but you see examples of this over and over in the Bible.  Again, this is going into more depth than this thread’s composer probably intented…LOL

*sam*
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:20 pm: [report]

@apex - hey! I didn’t say anything a/b what the bible does or doesn’t teach!! my comment was only meant to delineate my disgust at being preached at!!! what you believe is your own business and I would kindly appreciate it if you kept the ‘god/jesus loves you’ crap to a minimum (if not non-existent)

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:29 pm: [report]

@cheese:
You deny the persecution of the Romans toward the development of the new Christian church? It lived on and increased in believers.  Since you have some knowledge on the subject. Please tell my your thoughts -minus the vulgar commentary please.

Yes I know he was Jewish. That was his lineage from Abraham and God’s covenant made with him.  Instead of my thoughts, why dont you tell me about your views of that period of Christian history.  You seem rather inflamed by it, it doesn’t affect my faith and belief, but I’d like to know if your perspective on it.

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:39 pm: [report]

Sam- why does discussing this topic bother you so much?

Apex317
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:40 pm: [report]

I’ll check the responses later.  Its time to get to bed.  Take care you two-

*sam*
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:44 pm: [report]

@apex - hmm, b/c I happen to like (no, love) theFrisky and consider it my favorite lady site and when people start commenting long religious-based comments it irks me. like I said before, you’re entitled to your own opinions and beliefs, but, when you start ranting a/b god or jesus or whatever, it becomes preachy, and not-so-much a debate. if I wanted to read someone preaching the word of god to me, I’d go to a religious site or sermon, not my feminist, pro-sex Frisky.

Sofjna
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 09:45 pm: [report]

Maybe if we ignore it, it might just go away?  No, nevermind.  Probably not.

wonder_bread
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 10:31 pm: [report]

@Apex- i think u gave it a good try. i agree with what you said for the most part. i agree that having sex and living together before ur marriaged takes away from what made marriage special for most in the first place. every system has its rough spots but if we could apply the standards and wisdom of yesterdays with the knowledge of today i think we’d be better off…

wonder_bread
wrote on August 17 2009 @ 10:41 pm: [report]

@holleh- i agree with ur point of view as well. i don’t believe i have to live and have sex with someone in order to know that i love them and that we are compatible…. actually living and growing with them will help decided that as a couple and individual will help with that…. society wants everything to come easy and smooth without any hard work…which is probably why divorce looks so good. me and my future mate may not match in every way but u work through it. its the differences that make a relationship even more beautiful…

teal
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 04:42 am: [report]

Um, why are we talking about religion?

I am all for living with someone before marriage, under special circumstances.  The couple must be in a serious, committed relationship, mature, and have real plans to get married in the future.

Sure there are tons of dumb couples who live together for all the wrong reasons such as saving money, convenience, and the assumed fun they’d have by playing house.

And I’ve posted this statement before, but I want to readdress.  Typically couples who refuse to live together before marriage are religious.  Their religion is against getting divorced.  Therefore there is no valid argument here concerning live-in couples having a higher divorce rate compared to those who did not reside together.  This just means for religious couples, they got married and most likely will not divorce, no matter how unhappy they are in their marriage.

So the point is not whether it’s right or wrong to live together before marriage.  The point is whether the couple is mature enough in their relationship to do so because in their minds, they are already married (just without the paper).

teal
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 06:03 am: [report]

I just read the long posts from Apex317 and have some thoughts in response to some of his arguments in quotes:

“if you live together first…what makes getting married special anymore??”

How can you not see that just having that person in your life is special? Before making it official or after, the experience will always be special.  Are you are looking for a feeling of novelty to make marriage special?  Any smart couple will realize it is always special.  If not, once the novelty disappears after your marriage, what then?

“Personally, I think it takes more authentic love (on both sides), discipline, and focus to not live together and to keep it that way until you choose to get married.”

Huh??  What does having authentic love, discipline, and focus have to do with not living together until you’re married?  There is absolutely no correlation here.  My love for my partner is absolutely authentic, we are both disciplined, and we are both focused in the relationship.  I do not have to tell you whether we’re married or just live together.  Because it doesn’t matter in your argument!  Any serious relationship requires this strong foundation.

“The living together is the easy part, why rush it?”

Who says living together is easy.  Any committed couple realize it takes a lot of work, as in any serious relationship.  Why rush it?  Why do some couples rush to get married?  Does this marriage automatically deem them better suited?  Dumb people get married too.  You’re assuming that all couples who live together has rushed to live together.

“Look at all the cheating that goes on in those situations when people live together.”

Cheating may happen in any relationship.  If a person’s going to cheat, they’re going to do it whether there’s a ring on his/her finger or not.  A marriage will not prevent a person from straying.  Other reasons contribute to why a person strays…in a married situation or not.

“And the sex?? Sure, its there too, and great at first..but then when you get married..what’s left to learn or experience?  You ruined that experience for yourself.  There are consequences in life for taking the easy road.”

So you’re saying that sex has to be like it’s the first time in order for a marriage to be successful?  I’m sure you get a little bored yourself with your wife at times.  Did waiting to have sex with her until after marriage prevent you from having boring sex at times?  No, all couples may find themselves bored.  What do they do, they find ways to keep things alive, as in any marriage.

“Who wants an old used tire?”

Couples who are in love, will never view each other as an old tire.  Besides, wouldn’t you consider yourself as well as your wife an “old tire” after years of marriage too?  Don’t we all become “old tires” at some point in your context?

“Then what about STD’s”

Who are you talking to?  People who sleep around?  People who don’t use protection?  You’re talking to people who are monogamous.

“However, I believe if you do value marriage and want that for yourself one day….wait for that time. Get your act together on your own and date this person seperate from living with them. Take the steps to get to know them without the co-habitating.”

Wait for what time?  Wait until we’re committed and in love?  We are, and we most certainly have our act together already.  We choose to be together, and not together because we depend on each other.  Again, you are “preaching” to a certain group of couples who make the poor choice of living together without a commitment, without plans for marriage.  Not all couples are this blind.  It is the same as if I make arguments towards all married couples but only speak of the married couples who get divorced, who cheat, and who do not have “special” moments in their marriage.

I do not need a piece of paper to tell me that I’m in love and that I want to spend the rest of my life with my partner.  My heart, commitment, feelings, devotion tell me that, and that’s all we need for a successful relationship.  Our souls are already married.  And if we get married officially, then that is wonderful because it will just confirm what’s already been there for us.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 07:44 am: [report]

Nope, Apex I don’t want to argue semantics with you. You’ll believe what you want, and I’ll still call you a dumbass. And for your information ‘hell’ is not vulgar. Get off your high ‘religious’ horse and go rub one out for religious freedom.

*sam*
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 08:48 am: [report]

@wonder_bread: thank you for heartily disagreeing with my point of view without shoving your religious basis for them down my throat.—I respect that, immensely.

@teal: I agree with pretty much everything you stated. however, my only question is why do people have to already plan on getting married to cohabitate successfully? not that it doesn’t help, but, my question is what a/b those couples who don’t wish to marry…anyone, ever?? does their lack of marriage as an eventual goal doom them to failure? or does it just fall into the category of already having their souls married & just not needing a piece of paper to justify what they already know. (which, from my experience in knowing people like this, is how they tend to explain it).

teal
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 09:05 am: [report]

sam, good catch, thanks for bringing that to my attention.  i do mention several times that couples who decide to live together should have plans to “marry” in the future.  i should clarify that i don’t think everyone who is committed and in love need to marry, that is their prerogative.  so what i really should say in place of “marry” is “life-time commitment”.

wonder_bread
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 05:56 pm: [report]

@sam- i never can understand for as long as i’ve been on this site why its so biased..so if i don’t agree with ur main stream point of view i am now force feeding you my religion? feel free not to respond that is ur choice and if so debate it but don’t react so immaturely just because you don’t agree. in the end do whats best for your life i have no heaven or hell to put you in. my comments weren’t even directed to you.

i think the more i read post on this site the more i realise you have to be a die hard feminist that has no religious beliefs (and if you do you don’t defend it) with 2009 standards..which are low in my opinion…everything goes as long as its convinent…

wonder_bread
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 06:04 pm: [report]

@ sam i just read your comment over. sorry and your welcome. i’m just frustrated with the quality of debate this site produces and i read your comment wrong. i understand no one wants to be preached to but i never can wrap my brain around whenever someone mentions their religious views why everyone looses focus and gangs up on them instead of taking it with a grain of salt and simply responding back to the topic… its exhausting and normally comes off petty and immature when most of the back and forth happens…

*sam*
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 06:13 pm: [report]

@wonder_bread - yeah, I just sent you a PM… it’s kinda… bitchy, but in the most polite way!! lol, when I read your comment, I didn’t want to give you a long-winded response on here… but, thank you for re-reading it and understanding my point. but I understand your frustration. I think that a lot of people get up in arms a/b religious debates b/c (at least from my own personal experience) whenever someone of deep religious fate has tended to speak to anyone that doesn’t share their beliefs, we get this feeling that you’re talking down to us… IDK if this is how everyone feels, but I know that I certainly get that feeling a lot. at any rate, sorry if the PM comes off as offensive, but I was offended by your original comment

*sam*
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 06:19 pm: [report]

@wonder_bread: oh, and it genuinely takes a lot to offend/upset me, so, congrats(?) lol. :peace offering of oreo pie:

wonder_bread
wrote on August 18 2009 @ 06:23 pm: [report]

i will see it as an unintentional accomplishment lol it was not my intention to offend just merely get my point across as everyone else has….i accept and as i have stated i apologize for the mix up.

Apex317
wrote on August 20 2009 @ 05:54 am: [report]

I have given thought about the perspective stated here of being preached at. In some ways that is correct, I did inject personal judgment in a way on certain lifestyle choices posted of others, and I felt the backlash from it.  That’s not my place, I apologize. Perhaps that is where people feel offended by Christians when they voice their beliefs and opinions on life. They focus too much on themselves, and not enough on showing what Jesus Himself says on the matter and Christ’s ability to work in lives of those who seek Him. Perhaps this where people feel Christians are “better than thou.” In some cases that perception is valid, but for others it makes them uncomfortable based on many factors: could be guilt, previous hurtful exp with Christians.  It has once been said, there are two reasons people state they don’t go to church: 1. I don’t know a Christian and 2. I do know a Christian.  How well said.  Forgot about me- for those interested- take a minute to look at the Bible. It provides sound truths on this topic thread..and every avenue and challenge in life.  Its been a wonderful experience, and I am not ashamed to invite others to see for themselves.  One final word- Come as you are. Christ invites everyone this way. No preparation needed to get to know Him. This goes for everyone, even if one has had a hurtful experience before…try again. Come as you are, and receive in life- not just happiness, but joy from within…true peace.  This is one path that can be chosen from many on here…

Deborrah Cooper
wrote on October 8 2009 @ 09:07 am: [report]

Living together is what people choose to do that are actually hedging their bets. They don’t want to fully commit! Instead they are sticking their toe in the water, testing to see if the relationship is going to fail so they can get out with as little investment in the situation as possible. Neither is there to see how well it is going to work and what they can do to make that happen as a couple invested in a marriage would be.

I see living together as a convenient way for women to get used, and it amazes me how chicks don’t see that. Living with a man means you’ve signed on to provide “wifely services” for someone that is not your husband. Women automatically step into the domestic goddess role, assuming leadership for home decoration, cleanliness, organization, cooking, providing companionship, sex, a warm bed at night, someone to care for him, sometimes children, etc. That is what WIVES might do, and mere girlfriends should never do.

Young women of today have it backwards and give all they have to give to men with no ties, no obligations and no real commitment on the male’s part. There is no incentive for a man to marry if you are goofy enough to live with him and give all you got to him without marriage.

Women need to rethink this living together thing and value themselves and the comforts they bring to a man a lot higher than they do.

There is no benefit for a woman to live with a