A Father’s Blessing: Sexist Tradition Or A Sign Of Respect?

joyy
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 11:43 am: [report]

yikes.  I think the suggestion to pre-ask the gf to make sure SHE is interested would go a step further in my book - find out if what she thinks of these things, and use basic common sense.  For example, if the father was a negative force in her life, then asking dad first could make the gf not so happy (I’d take it that way). 

But I know girls who’s now-fiances asked the parents (not just the dad) first and they think it’s the most adorable and romantic thing ever, and I get the impression that it adds to the whole thing for them.  Suss it out and communicate - but isn’t that pretty standard advice for pretty much every relationship situation?!

WinkyFace
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 11:50 am: [report]

I’m going to sound like a hypocrite because yesterday I said it was creepy that girls stay pure for their fathers… but personally I like the idea of asking the father for permission. It’s just a nice tradition, and it does show respect for the girl’s family. Now, as joyy pointed out, it would depend on the girl. Some people don’t have good relationships with their fathers, or no father at all. It’s also a sign of recognizing that when you want to marry someone, you’re going to be accepting their entire family into your life, too.

My brother flew down to San Diego to ask his future in-laws for permission. I really admired that and I think it made a great impression on her parents.

brackishfaun
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 11:57 am: [report]

I always thought it would be really cute if my boyfriend asked my dad’s permission to marry me, but I do think that it is a kind of silly tradition at the same time. I agree that it depends on the girl’s relationship to her father. I’m close to my dad and its important to me that my father likes the guy I’m with.

lalaland
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:01 pm: [report]

While I think it differs from woman to woman, I love the idea of a man asking my parents (they are divorced and he will have to talk to both of them, he would lose major points with momma if he only talked to my dad…). For me it is a sign of respect for the people who raised me and is completely romantic!

But I do agree with the author, a man needs to be sure of where a woman stands on this and have a very good idea of how she’s going to respond to his proposal.

RachelSmiles
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:09 pm: [report]

if my dad would have asked my mom’s parents permission they would have said no.

that said, i think its a little antiquated. its not my dad’s decision. if he had a big enough problem with the guy i was dating he would say something before it got to the point of a proposal.

toyen
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:16 pm: [report]

I am torn on this one. My mom told me pretty much that she’d be devastated if a guy I was planning to marry didn’t ask them. It doesn’t really matter to me, other than knowing it is important to them. So when I thought I was getting married last year, I mentioned it to my ex and told him that it was really important to them that he asked. Well, he completely freaked out and couldn’t do it (and got major commitmentphobia all around), and never did ask them. I think next time around, I’ll do everything much more casually. Hell, forget a traditional engagement and just head to the court house.

shannac02
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:20 pm: [report]

I’m not that close to my dad, but I would EXPECT a man that was that serious about me, to approach my dad and ask for his blessing… Not permission, Blessing.
Aaaaand that’s my two cents.

becktasm
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:31 pm: [report]

The whole idea is so antiquated, but I still think it’s a sweet gesture. It would vary situationally, like lalaland mentioned, but on the whole I like the idea. Coming from a family of all boys, I’ve always been daddy’s little girl, and I think he would be impressed by any man who mustered up the courage to ask him for my hand. It’s very respectful.

KT09
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:37 pm: [report]

I think what I enjoyed most when I got engaged was the fact that my boyfriend found it important to ask my parents for their blessing.  It showed that he understood that he was going to be a member of an extended family now that included more than just us.  I bet I would have been insulted if he had asked just my dad “for my hand in marriage,” but instead, he sat down with both my parents and asked for their blessing.

My family is important to me, and if the people who have known me for longer than anyone else didn’t want me marrying someone, I would have to think really hard about whether that person was right for me.  On that note, maybe I also should have asked HIS parents for their blessing (I didn’t, but I also knew that they approved).  It is a respectful tradition that you can decide to include in your life or not.  To each their own.

dream316
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 12:47 pm: [report]

I don’t see why it has to be the father’s blessing and not both of the parents.  I think that the concept of asking for the blessing is respectful and shouldn’t be done away with, but including the mother would make the concept seem less outdated.

VannaMarie
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 01:02 pm: [report]

I agree that this varies from situation to situation, but discussing it with her family first I think is very important. Dad first, if he is available - if not, then mother/brother or next closest kin. Also, if he is serious about wanting to marry a woman, he should know her family dynamics well enough to know what’s right.

In my situation, I wouldn’t have accepted the proposal right away if he had not asked, as family is very important to me. Fortunately, I had warned him of this well before he was ready to ask… Even though my step-dad and I were not really close growing up, I agree with the post above when they say it is in respect to those who raised me and respect as he was asking to become a new part of the family, and I of his.

I find that it really set the tone for the wedding, and made my family closer to him knowing that he was able to be vulnerable to them AND me. He feels much closer to them now than before and I think this tradition helped accelerate that.

VannaMarie
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 01:08 pm: [report]

After reading the title to this article, I thought I should mention that even though I have such strong feelings on keeping this tradition going, I should mention that I am a very independent woman who is career oriented and socially liberal. Funny that the article is on this tradition, because there are others that I am not such a fan of… But I do see this topic as a respect issue and not sexist. Blessing v. permission as shannaco2 stated.

loveitlala
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 01:11 pm: [report]

This sounds soooooooooo stupid.  My ex told my parents he would propose and never did.  I wish he would have just left my family out of it!

mayfaire
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 01:40 pm: [report]

To be perfectly honest, I would be pretty offended if my boyfriend asked for my parents permission.  I love my family and yes, they would have to accept him too… but ultimately I’m an independent adult, and deciding to marry is my decision and doesn’t involve my parents.  Also I’m pretty sure that’s what my dad would say if BF even asked…

There seems to be such a wide variety of opinions on this one.  I guess this more than anything underlies the importance of the “making sure your girlfriend is on the same page” step!

calenia
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 04:39 pm: [report]

I would say no to any man who asked me to marry him if he asked for my father’s “blessing”, he obviously wouldn’t know me well enough to know how absurdly offensive it is. I am my own person; an adult and don’t need anyone’s permission to do anything from sign a contract to getting married. I wouldn’t marry someone without them meeting my family since my family is important to my life but I don’t need their approval or blessing to continue in a relationship or advance one to marriage. Since my father is deceased I don’t actually have this worry but I can’t think of a reason why this is supposed to be respectful and would consider it a dealbreaker if my boyfriend participated in such jackassery.

Katrina
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 04:45 pm: [report]

I would make my boyfriend ask my dad just because it would be hilarious…my dad is rather brash and outspoken and my boyfriend is shy and kind of afraid of my dad :D

Shirana
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 06:30 pm: [report]

All of the friends who’s father’s were asked knew well in advance what the visit home was about . . . especially those who had to travel out of town to have the conversation.  All of those same friends are some of the strongest most independent women that I know - and also, very close to their families.  A couple were serious “Daddy’s Girls,” but not all.  Each time, I thought how tickled my Dad (and Mom) would be if some man made a point to assure them that he has my best interests in mind before asking me to trust him with the rest of my life.  Not only romantic, but a pretty cool indication of his willingness to commit to me, I think. . . and I haven’t asked my parents for permission for squat in the 20+ years since my 16th birthday!

rsonnack
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 07:41 pm: [report]

@ Mayfaire and Calenia, I agree with you that asking for the father’s permission for a woman’s hand is demeaning to our independence. But, I think there is a difference between “asking for permission” and “talking it over and getting the parents’ blessing.” Also I would be highly upset if my boyfriend only talked to my dad and not my mom too, like lalaland said, my parents are divorced too). If, and only if, the woman is close to her family, the boyfriend should sit down with them and talk to them about his plans. There are some women with families that may not agree with their daughter’s choice in a partner, and it may be for some stupid reason, like he is of a different race or doesn’t make a lot of money. In cases like that, the parents may say no, in which case it would be fine to go against the parents’ wishes and proceed with the engagement. However, if the parents say no because they know the boyfriend is a cheater, or some other really terrible personality flaw that the girlfriend is just too blindly in love to notice, then their opinion should definitely be taken into account.

Ginger
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 08:31 pm: [report]

I don’t think that someone should need a parent’s permission, but it does help when you have their approval.
That said, I think more than just the father should be asked. When my dad got engaged to my stepmother, before he asked her, he sat me down and made sure that I was alright with the idea.
After he asked her (or it might have been a little before) he spoke to her mother and father to see what they thought about the idea. Not to ask for permission, so much as to show that he respects them as her parents. I’ve always thought that was a good thing for my father to do.
Likewise, my stepmother’s father had to ask his wife’s parents multiple times. Albeit, that was in the sixties, they were different races, and her family was a very traditional mexican one.
It sounded romantic to me when I heard that story, because he kept fighting for her. But these days I don’t think one needs permission to marry someone’s daughter. They shouldn’t at least, because, to me at least, it smacks of ownership and creepy religions.
But asking for approval and making it clear that the family’s opinion matters in this case seems wildily appropriate.

vegdumpling
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 08:40 pm: [report]

i would be offended if my boyfriend did that.  showing respect to my family has nothing to do with including them in a life decision that they have nothing to do with.

my family loves my boyfriend and he hasn’t really asked them for permission for anything other than driving my mom’s porsche.  they’ve gotten to know each other and seen how he is with me and that’s all that’s important.  my sister even refers to him as “brother,” but none of that has to do with involving them in parts of our lives where they don’t belong.

saysay
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 10:59 pm: [report]

I don’t think that having your boyfriend ask “permission” or for a “blessing” of some sort should bother anybody… chances are you’re aware that your relationship is nearing a proposal… if the two of you haven’t discussed marriage yet, well, that’s a horse of a different color. If he feels that asking is important, then be happy! As out-dated as it may seem, it all really boils down to respect, and I’m sure we all want our sig others to respect our parents.

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on April 3 2009 @ 11:07 pm: [report]

Ok this is my first time weighing in on this particular post, but wasn’t there a editorial recently, within the last week, on chivalry. I know crap changes in the world, and I am well aware that I have a penis, drink beer, and swear frequently, but I think this is quite a romanticized idea. I can understand arguments over issues with dad, but in general, women love their fathers very much and this will seem like an over the top step in the right direction for the future of marriage, and I kinda like the idea of having another cool guy who I am comfortable with enough to drink beer and watch football with, and isn’t that what is really important?

LaGiulia
wrote on April 4 2009 @ 09:10 am: [report]

My dad’d say “no” to anyone. That’s why I don’t ask him permission to do anything, least of all stuff that has to do with my personal life. I’m 36, but to him I’m still his kid

retro chic
wrote on April 4 2009 @ 09:25 am: [report]

@LaGiulia, um hmm, same here. In fact, my dad would be surprised if I even asked, and that’s after recovering from the shock alone of hearing I’d want to get married.

However, he still calls to make sure I get my oil changed, and I’m no 36, but as you said… I’m still his kid.

Pamela
wrote on April 4 2009 @ 01:45 pm: [report]

i dont find it the least sexist, haha never thought about it that way. my dad asked both my mom’s parents before popping the question to her. its kind of sweet and chivalry like. i see it as a way of the guy saying “i will be able to provide to her, im just not a punk that wants to f*ck all day long” hahah

nemesis1
wrote on April 4 2009 @ 07:17 pm: [report]

Think on this: right now, in some dusty theocracy somewhere, a fourteen year old girl is being given away in marriage to a complete stranger. No one asked her permission. No one consulted her. Her family made sure - by brutal methods - that she remained a virgin until her wedding day.

But American women won’t help her. Why? They’re too busy WHINNING about ‘sexist’ traditions like asking a father’s permission for marriage.

I can list some other sexist traditions. Holding a door open for a woman. Giving a woman your seat on the subway. Helping a woman with heavy packages. Engagement rings. Perhaps we should do away with those. Perhaps some men already are . . .

As for this:

“i see it as a way of the guy saying “i will be able to provide to her . . .”

So then, ‘providing’ for a woman isn’t a sexist tradition, is it? Of course not - since women can’t provide for themselves.

I get the logic here. When a tradition is convenient for a woman, it’s not sexist. When it’s inconvenient for a woman, it’s sexist.

Right. The problem now is getting a nation of dumb-ass manginas to wake up and smell the double standards and hypocrisy.

(. . . Meanwhile, somewhere in the world, a helpless, brutalized young girl wishes she could voluntarily fall in love with someone not of her father’s choosing.)

CheeeeEEEEse
wrote on April 4 2009 @ 07:43 pm: [report]

@Nemesis1: The father most likely gave away the daughter for a goat or something.

theoldman
wrote on April 4 2009 @ 08:26 pm: [report]

When you marry some one for better or worse you marry their family as well.  How you establish that relationship can be very important for the long term viability of your marriage.  The man is asking to be come a member of HER family.  It is a ritual that shows acceptance and inclusion. It also helps cement the bonds as a family member that mean that they will be there to help you when you need it and helps avoid the “it’s me or the dog” showdowns for your spouse where the family takes sides rather than mediating. Permission is outdated and reminds me of the days when a woman had to get her husband’s permission to sell her own property. Blessing is a much better approach and represents the building of a relationship.

EnlightenMe
wrote on April 5 2009 @ 02:11 am: [report]

@Nemesis

I totally get where you’re coming from about the double-standard.  I’m in an Anthropology class right now in college and it is one of the most interesting classes I have ever taken.  In regards to what you’re saying about arranged marriages, there are actually many people who don’t find those situations to be negative ones, and I’m talking about the people who are being married, the ones directly involved.

Anyway, about the hypocrisy of men vs. women, I think it’s romantic.  Not because I’m a sexist bastard that doesn’t think that women can take of themselves, but because I don’t think that my woman should HAVE to take care of herself unless that’s what she wants to do.  I love her and want to make sure that she feels appreciated, so whatever I can do to give her that feeling should be done.  I don’t think it’s sexist or unwelcome at all to show chivalry unless it is unwanted by the woman in question.  It’s not my job to look after my woman, but it shows that I love her when I do.

nemesis1
wrote on April 5 2009 @ 04:33 am: [report]

Independence?

Female ‘indepenence’ in America is a delusion. You depend on men for countless things. You depend on men to fight your wars. (Men comprise about 99% of war-time casualties.) You depend on men to do dangerous jobs. (Men comprise about 95% of workplace fatalities.) You depend on men to pay alimony and child support when YOU divorce them. (Women initiate 70% of divorces.) You depend on male taxpayer money for women-only social programs. Etc, etc, etc.

Come April 14, I am witholding from my tax payments any moneys that go to support women-only or women dominated social programs. I advise all men to do the same, so that women can finally have the indepenence they seek.

If we REALLY wanted to give you independence, we’d pull up stakes and leave to to your own devices. And then we’d wait a year until you came crawling back for our help. Like Camille Paglia said, if women ruled the world, we’d still be living in grass huts.

If you want indepenence, start paying your share of the dating ritual, and do away with expensive engagement rings or buy equivalent gifts for men.

Women want independence in their marriages until it comes time to enlist Big Daddy State to unjustly confiscate a man’s wealth and children in divorce court. That’s when women drop the ‘independent’ act and boo-hoo their way through mock proceedings to prove how helpless they are.

Oh, but I’m just an angry little man, aren’t I. I guess so. After all, male anger is illegitimate, and only female anger is acceptable. But what happens when enough men get angry? I’ll tell you what happens; we tell all of you to screw off. 

The truth is, western women want equality and independence, but only when it’s convenient. This goes for traditional women as well as radical feminists. And since feminism has done away with the ability for introspection and reason in western women, none of you has the ability to see your part in things. You are, in effect, children. And none of you will address this point, because you know it’s accurate.

I’ll say something here that you’ll all completely ignore; many, many men are starting to wake up. They’re sick and tired of whinny, entitled western women who insist on double standards and having their cake and eating it too. We’re sick of the spoiled, vapid little brats that western women have become. The marriage rate is declining rapidly. Why? because men aren’t buying the nonsense anymore. It’s not because they want more time to play WoW. It’s because western women make lousy wives.

In fact, American women are so scared of the reality that American men don’t want them anymore, they prompted the government to pass a law requiring background checks for men who meet foreign women over the internet. This law is not for preventing human trafficking or other perversions; in truth, most American women could care less about those things. It’s to limit the competition.

About 80% of my married male friends are absolutely miserable, because they live with whinny, entitled, self-centered brats with no grasp on reality. The best way for men to grant women the ‘indepenence’ they seek is to do away with marriage altogether. Give women what they ask for - a big ‘No thank you.’

Sofjna
wrote on April 5 2009 @ 07:12 pm: [report]

WOW! You are an ass.  Not all of us are like that.  Maybe you should try meeting other women, not just those who are prissy, brainless, stuck up bitches.  Oh, but then you wouldn’t have anything to be miserable about and complain of everyday.

EnlightenMe
wrote on April 6 2009 @ 12:05 am: [report]

@Nemesis

I want to save and frame your post so I can hang on my wall or at least show my friends what you just said.  It’s so truthfull.

Now of course not all women are like that, definitely not a majority.  But there are those out there that act exactly like how Nemesis describes them.

Either way, I still stand by what I said previously about the woman that I will inevitably end up finding and loving.  I think that the friends that Nemesis has just made poor decisions when marrying the women they did and should have chosen otherwise if they are so unhappy now.  I don’t see marriage like that, but I’m a pretty unique individual to begin with so whatev…

Chelle
wrote on April 6 2009 @ 03:10 am: [report]

@nemesis1- Wow I wish that b.s. you just spewed out was true. Then maybe I wouldn’t be the one paying child support. Maybe I wouldn’t of had to support my ex when I used to make more money than him and when he was in between jobs. When I was engaged I didn’t have an expensive engagement ring. When I go on dates I split the bill or take turns on who pays if I date them more than once. When I was younger, I paid for everything on dates. So maybe you should hop down off your high horse and realize that, when you make broad generalizations, you only make a fool out of yourself.

joyy
wrote on April 6 2009 @ 08:32 am: [report]

@nemisis - good luck not sending in the portion of your tax money that would go to “women only” social programs.  Are you really retarded enough to think you can do that?  And you seem to forget that working women’s tax dollars fund everything that working men’s tax dollars do. 

Where do you live that you consistently fail to recognize how many women actually work for a living to support themselves - and many times others as well?

Wendy Atterberry
wrote on April 6 2009 @ 09:38 am: [report]

You heard it from the Truth King, everyone: a marriage proposal has nothing to do with a woman! How dare we make everything about us!

laurzipan
wrote on April 9 2009 @ 09:40 am: [report]

my fiance asked my MOM if he could marry me.

my father passed away in 2002, and my mother has since gotten remarried (to her high school sweetheart, awww).  i love my stepfather very much, especially because he knows there’s a line between stepdad and real dad that he absolutely will not cross. 

my fiance knows that the relationship i have with my mother is very special, and he wanted to make sure that the First Most Important Person In My Life gave the okay to the Second Most Important Person In My Life.  don’t get me wrong, he gets along very well with my stepfather (we all do, he rules), but he wanted to save the moment of “asking permission” for my mother. 

what a guy

lil_jake
wrote on April 12 2009 @ 05:54 am: [report]

I don’t have a problem with the tradition, at all.  I think it’s kind of cute.  Two things to note:

1.  It’s not really “permission” so much as a “blessing”.  My parents, obviously, wouldn’t stand in the way of my true love with some guy, but it’s nice to have their blessing in anything I do.  Plus, it is respectful.

2.  For all you rappin’ on sexist traditions, you are aware that the whole ceremony is “sexist”, right?  Are you going to wear a short gold lame dress and have him walk down the aisle toward you?  Dance with your mother for the father-daughter dance?  Carry him across the threshold?

Srsly.